Lava Network: A Marketplace for RPC Providers

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1. 0:00

   nothing we say here is investment advice legal advice life advice or representative of the views of the organization we are part of or affiliated with see chain abstracted tocom for more hey everybody uh this is chain abstracted it's actually episode 12 uh so we have y with us from lava uh which we're quite excited I know near folks have been kind of working closely with uh lava and we're seeing a lot more chains coming in and working with them

2. 0:25

   as well so happy to have you here and uh love to love to hear a background you are and then we can deep dive into lava later yeah for sure you know so uh super excited to be here always good to chat with the the near ecosystem uh we're a big believer in chain obstruction um and actually you know I I think one of the first video when I jumped into the industry was 3 years ago and I was seeing Ilia on a podcast uh you know it was uh kind of

3. 0:55

   the white Bor that he's doing but uh in a you know real uh class I could say uh so but just uh just uh you know couple of words about my background I I studed Computer Engineering um B born and raised in Israel I was uh in a special program in the Army and I started my first startup when I was 21 so entrepreneurship always attracted me I like to bring uh new abilities and um you know develop

4. 1:25

   scalable products um and uh my co-founder was also in one of the top top intelligence unit and we jumped into web 3 uh 3 years ago actually it was the you know the uh nft summer and um you see back at the time we we thought that um ethereum was kind of the only Manet right so um there were a lot of kind of different infrastructure but they were a bit unreliable so we realized from the moment we arrived that you

5. 1:56

   know to be a single provider that Loring the uh the barrier for DBS for user to communicate with the chain itself it's a must right so uh every ecosystem Every Chain that's coming up needs to have this basic layer of accessing whether it's RPC indexing oracles and we we set up the focus to uh make sure that we first of all starting with uh the first layer right it's RPC and uh RPC is the most basic communication protocol and it has to be

6. 2:36

   faster and much more decentralized there and um you know while we started back then we thought why today the infra is kind of right um You you think about you access the wallet you uh you don't see the account balance you cannot make a transaction you get a error and um this is not the good fundamentals for uh scalable and uh you know um to bring the billion DBS and user to come to the to the space and while we started like you know two years ago we think that uh

7. 3:15

   the space has grown much so we discover even a much bigger problem if we started from a decentralized RPC we've seen that every chain is actually struggling with the same thing right in a multi-chain world the first thing that the chain has to do is to provide this access layout to bring DS communicate read write transactions but what about not only RPC how about indexing subgraph oracles and this is when the lava Vision evolve to

8. 3:46

   be actually data access layer that connects any user any dap to any blockchains out there awesome so I guess the problem you saw which is you started with PC and then growing into Data layer um is that was that motivated by personal experience or is it more like hey you just started talking to folks and Foundations be like because one of the things that you know we we saw when I was working at Fe Foundation is like having the RPC keep and running is pretty tough right you kind of need to

9. 4:20

   do it in a very centralized way a lot of Foundations go in a way of like hey let's just find one or two providers that you know provide that so how did it evolve like how did the idea came out to be so yeah definitely I think uh you know the first steps uh and What attracted me to crypto was my co-founder started building bats uh did some me uh and um we've seen that the basic layer

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    of interacting with the blockchain is not straightforward right if you only have ethereum so you need to run an ethereum node but then you have near to run a NE node and any other chain that up and coming it doesn't make sense to to uh for the end user for the DB to run the nodes there right so we thought about how lava can help major chains like ethereum near to aggregate optimize

11. 5:10

    scale their existing RPC provider and it's kind of obstructing away the the complexity of using different providers instead of um the dab coming to you to a new chain and and looking for what are the providers that providing that give access to this chain we thought about the One-Stop shop in a much more uh Less in a less fragmented way and uh to really bring the the access to to solve this problem we see that chains kind of

12. 5:41

    struggling to to solve this problem and every chain goes through the same uh through the same line of thought right and the process uh starting a new chain maybe not a reputable chain so then you need to approach the providers the RPC providers and have a contract to them you don't you're not sure about the um you know quality of data that they serving and so forth so you're ending up wasting your resources um taking the chain team to actually implement this

13. 6:13

    the own load balancer uh backup disaster recovery and so forth um but it's end up in you know not utilizing the resources all the funds for bringing more apps and build the real technology like for example you building enough right so I think what the chains get with lava it's a blockchain that help them bootstrap and optimize any decentralized RPC um and this is this is what this was the first steps we thought about uh Uber

14. 6:46

    for nodes so every node Runner can join this Marketplace and serve receive rewards based on the quality of service okay yeah that that mental model makes sense to me um just before we go deep dive into like the mechanics of the network and obviously I'll link that to Chin abstraction as usual um what like what is an RPC right like I think users you know we we know what is an RPC is I mean I'm technical you're technical it's it's like request and response right so

15. 7:18

    if you ask a provider to provide you data first of all um sometimes you ending up not getting the data right I I guess you happen it happen to you sometimes when you're opening the the wallet and you don't see the account balance right you cannot refresh you cannot fetch or send transactions uh so this is why you know that's one of the problems that I mentioned like single point of failure provider is stop having a he has downtime and when the provider

16. 7:48

    has downtime you can get access with your wallet to the blockchain itself um that results in other problems as well you know we spoke briefly about privacy censorship resist and one of the core values of blockchains and obviously we spoke about if uh um uh the provider is providing you the data but what about is he providing you not the latest block what if he provides you a malicious data and we see some DNS hijacking and uh attacks like that so you know every time

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    you think uh about RPC you think about what's my if balance right uh what's um and and then this is the request right and the response from a odd Runner it's you have one if as the latest block but you want to make sure that this is actually correct and you don't want to implement other nodes Runner and you know to Benchmark between them so this problem of data reliability data accuracy is something that was not

18. 8:52

    straightforward yes it's basically like um whenever you use anything on on crypto right so like a front end which is the website you see needs to talk to the blockchain so anything that goes through anything that you want to grab and do something it needs to go through an RPC correct so like any interaction so the most important thing in crypto is like with for user experience is actually have a very reliable RPC that

19. 9:16

    you can actually provide is that like what I'm getting and then we can see sort of like how lava solves that right which is obviously talked about a little bit you know uh lava Network being being in marketplace right for for RPC where you have people come to Lava the the supply side which is I would say like the the rpcs themselves and the demand side which is kind of people coming in and pinging that Network definitely so

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    just just to summarize you know we can think about RPC is the way of how wallets daps connect to the blockchains and allowing user to and and also developers to do the basic things right uh it involved the uh making the request and getting the response for someone else that's running those RPC nodes and try and getting access to the blockchain that you're trying to connect to right

21. 10:03

    so if you think about RPC this is essentially the core fundamental for any blockchain interaction you want to read transaction you want to see the account balance you want to swap you want to trade you want a mint an nftd you want to sell a shitcoin like whatever right uh so this is what it's important for me as a takeaway from here okay yeah so I guess lava is a Marketplace um how does

22. 10:28

    the technical infrastru structure work is that like an L1 is that an L2 is that a Dap I know the answer to that but I just want you to explain like what's your uh what's your sort of take and how you kind of started building the infrastructure and then the number two is you said well you know we want to make sure that um notes provide a right service and how do you do that with what mechanics that you kind of use for that

23. 10:50

    super so if you know we think about it simple right so we think about um that lava lets any user and developer to connect to all other blockchain the same way that you know Celestia is using uh provide the da layer for all other blockchain so lava provides the data access and you use the right term you said Marketplace so what what does it mean right if you are a lava um if you want to be a lava provider you need to have what we call a proof of quality or

24. 11:21

    accountability so any RPC provider that has access to a specific chain basically uh is is able to it needs to stake lava to make sure is this is the way to enter the marketplace right once you stake lava um you can serve RPC request and uh the way you receive the request is based on two parameters one of them is the quality of service uh whatever you did in the previous transaction and scoring

25. 11:51

    mechanism in order to give you a score yourself and the second thing is based on the stake So based on these two things um you receive as a provider you receive service and you are able to serve um you also rewarded for this at the end of the months based on the quality of service um the staking mechanism is uh holding them accountable in a way that if somehow you didn't you didn't send the latest block or even you presented malicious um uh data you you

26. 12:24

    as a node Runner is able to be can uh be prone to be jailed or even slashed and this is the way we kind of balancing the economic demand here with um creating the blockchain uh the lava blockchain is a is a up chain it's based on Cosmos SDK uh tender Min we use this uh super scalable uh Tech stack to um in order to you know make sure that we bring and we deliver fast and you know actually it is since the test net it's already serving

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    transactions um and it's more than one uh one and a half years almost um so you know um you you think about lava as a Marketplace as a permissionless Amazon is is the same way that Amazon connects consumer to Merchants to buy any item lava connects uh users or daps to any node providers to provide any type of uh data it's stared with RPC we spoke about indexing subgraph oracles and everything everything there I see makes sense okay

28. 13:32

    so like one ethereum for example if you double sign as as a as a validator you get slashed right or you have other conditions uh to kind of not act in the same in the way that you should not act so on lava you kind of have a similar condition where you know if the data is not quality if you're not responding to the service like that people are requesting you kind of like have kind of like a ranking in system it's like a

29. 13:57

    game gamified version of for for any provider really like data sub graph RPC obviously you guys started with RPC but going to do more stuff um so it becomes like a it's quite similar mechanisms but you guys are using the same mechanism for quality of service that everybody requires that's what I so lava lava is built around the the bread butter of lava is the quality of service right

30. 14:21

    they I'm you know inviting everyone who's listening uh to dive even deeper there are amazing blogs talking about different mechanism in lava conflict detection uh conflict resolution how the validators are participating to secure the chain and so forth it's super fascinating you know we use Game Theory to uh module kind of the benchmarking of the data sampling the providers when they don't they they are not aware of that in order to make sure that the data

31. 14:51

    is accurate and um you know it's uh I I was lucky to work with kind of the top Minds in the space awes awesome man I that's that's great I mean it's interesting because it's like you know it is it's almost like um the the realization of the app chain thesis I mean app chain L2 thesis in a sense where people are building app chains I mean there's like a lot of l2s that don't know what they are doing right like you know they're just launching l2s just for the sake of L2 on the lava case is quite unique in the sense that you actually to using the

32. 15:25

    blockchain for one thing and one thing only which is quality of service um which which is kind of excites me in a sense that like you know there's obviously there'll be dozens of chains we all know some chains are like kind of like I don't even know what this is right like I just launch a chain obviously but some of them like you guys like hey you know or dydx or just or somebody else that specifically does this thing or I mean Celestia is a good

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    example ail is a good example right like does this thing and does this thing only um so uh quite excited about that um how do you think about like now going back to sort of chain of right like how do you think about this what's your internal thesis because your chain abstraction is in a sense that you're using the chain to build a Marketplace um but how do you think this is going to evolve and how does like

34. 16:11

    lava participate in this sort of uh efforts you think exactly so uh just to take one step uh maybe back is that um we spoke a bit about the technology and how it works um so it's important to emphasize that lava is not a single point of failure so every dab straight from the browser is connected H to dozens of providers so it makes it like um all the scoring mechanism uh the subscription the reward everything is on chain so everything is uh available and

35. 16:45

    transparent for the users but this is how we simplifying we we started building with simplifying the model but what happened last October is that many chains started to approach us and say okay so you're actually doing the centralized RPC but there is a more interesting place when you can help us a lot and this is the public RPC that every chain has and this is the moment when uh lava launched pools right uh pools are basically a incentive pools

36. 17:19

    that every chain deploying its own token inviting providers to join so they get getting at the end of every month the rewards based on the quality of service so imagine that in the near future you as as you said dozens of new chain are up and coming think about the the you know the process of they going to each and every provider receiving quotes have lockin contracts why right in one you know in few minutes you can spin up its own pool deposit tokens and invite

37. 17:52

    provider that's exactly what OS did back then in in October so the this is the this is the primary way that lava is different from any other RPC provider and this is when the vision expanded to be a a unique access layer to the entire blockchain so you know um in the last uh in the last four years you see crazy traction coming especially from the pools like um you know on the technical

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    side we had a way to scale the servers uh Community side you see the foundation did a great great job of bringing more and more noge Runners but at the end of the day you see that not only in OS in Axel are and now we near we have more more demand to uh to this kind of pools um so yeah that's what I'm super excited in um today awesome um and so lva pools what else is like in your road map lva pools

39. 18:56

    launch you said last year right is it you said October for most most yeah so what else is on the road map that people should get get excited about and learn more you guys so um you know we started with the pools themselves but I think it one of the problems with um um deploying a the first product is that you are super excited about that you as entrepreneur also see that you're excited you want it to go everywhere but sometime the risk is that you you're going to spread too thin

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    so uh that's what uh we decided to implement the first pools on on different kind of categories and domain that's why I chose Axel almost n Year everyone has its own benefits and different by the use cases um and um you know the the next thing obviously we talking about uh is now after minute launch right um I think it was important for the lava Foundation uh to present the tokenomics and talk about the different actors serving and uh bringing

41. 20:05

    value to the chain itself so you know just a recap lava lava pools means that RPC node operator can join lava and serve RPC and earn tokens but every token holder obviously can delegate to a validator and can restake to additional node provider so I know the concept of reaking is familiar for other da igen layer and stuff but re reakes actually gives normal token holder the opportunity to impact the performance of all the network cuz you remember that every provider receiving service based

42. 20:44

    on the quality of service and their stake so first a delegator can stake it to a validator but then they can help an RPC provider to get more uh to get more service and this is how it's kind of uh helps the community to select and boost the best RPC provider and influence the overall performance of the network uh I'm really excited about uh this feature and uh you know to see we just launched the chain so uh happy to see what what

43. 21:17

    the future holds so there's lava you you you stake lava and you get restake lava which then you can use to give it to they could that gives you voting power or give it to like the RPC providers that do well yes in every chain you know the the lava is used as utility it can help you to participate in the Dow governance you know taking delegation rewards but the unique part here is what how do the

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    community help influence on the best node Runners out there if you see a very good node Runner it's not about the marketing it's about the performance every all the information is in on chain so you see the reputable node Runner and you can earn more rewards by reaking to this you as a token holder by reaking to a specific node Runner I see I see okay so it's kind of a similar concept as igir but the different different use

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    case I because igir is like more like hey I'm going to restate this to anybody right who's going to do something for me and uh they can use his eth lava is more like hey I'm going to restake to a node Runner that um you know that does something okay interesting I did not know that that's I mean it's quite unique cuz the restak is going to yeah reaking is gonna restak is becoming like a thing everywhere like I mean it

46. 22:41

    started in ethereum obviously actually started in Cosmos and other ecosystems first went to ethereum later and then now it's coming back everywhere right um it's cool um so yeah how what's your what's your it's also important to keep it simple right because there are so many things up and coming but you want to keep it simple especially polish The Narrative and make sure that you know it goes clear to the community and to

47. 23:07

    everyone else that want you want to join to the community yeah yeah um so yeah what's what's your chain abstraction thesis internally then like how do you how do you see this evolve um like and then I'll ask like after that like what's your advice for for Founders coming in today and you know like now that there's this bunch of chains like what should Founders look into I know you've looked into obviously RPC which

48. 23:32

    is every chain needs but is there something that you seeing that Founders should pay more attention to in your in your you know in your head yeah you know uh I think you know when I started crypto uh everyone talk about consolidation of the l1s they not going to be a lot of l1s l2s was just at the the beginning um today you know that this is the other way around you have so many different doctrines from chain obstruction to sh security to uh um you know modularity and so forth and if you

49. 24:07

    think about the different building blocks you think about you know the execution layer the settlement layer uh the data availability and consensus layer and it doesn't matter which Doctrine you choose at the end of the day we realize that there is a force layer it's something you know it twed recently the force forgotten layer and this is act cuz how will chains make sure that DS

50. 24:31

    building on that when they you know when they cannot provide this basic service access how to chain make sure that the wallets the end users that you know using providers um will make sure that they can do transaction they buy an nft and all of that so I think the fourth layer is something that uh super uh um you know excites me and um in general we thought about lava is aggregating all of that multi-chain infrastructure way I I deeply believe in the chain obstruction

51. 25:03

    uh it's it's kind of the basic today you know the the near uh data availability layer it's um it's uh it's something that I see more and more especially with your use case is a fast finality layer um if if you can bring this ability of uh transaction settlement between different chain I think it can bring very interesting you know use case uh think about um defi right protocol can utilize these fast finality layers and interact with uh you know liquidity

52. 25:37

    pools across various chains so at the end of the day uh the end user get better rates and more option um uh you think about um you know a use case I thought recently it's something about interoperable nfts right um so optimizing all the interest rate and at the end of the day liquidities so so nfts can be transferred you know across different blockchains and if one nft is created on ethereum um easily you can uh

53. 26:08

    you know use it in games or uh sell it on marketplaces but on another chains so I think it's going to be super exciting um um next couple of months and obviously years with the chain obstruction uh that that unlocking this potential to eliminate the complexity of interacting with multiple blockchain yeah how do you think about the services in in a chain abstracted world like is it um how do we I guess love is working

54. 26:42

    on that already um but do you have any do you have any thoughts like hey like services are going to improve Services gonna degrade like how do you how do you think about it because I I since you know since my first startup I always a big advocate of keep it simple right if you I I I think that um the the non- consolidation the the the the world that we're going to live in of multiple chains it represent kind of humanity in

55. 27:13

    general right everyone wants to express itself everyone wants its own Community its own token and um you need to make sure that the building blocks are super scalable resilient and reliable um if you you were to think that after we finishing the call and you surfing the web you type www. doesn't matter what do you know what is the HTTP version that you use do you know where the the website is stored

56. 27:45

    is it AWS gcp you have no idea right and this kind of obstruction made the internet the Web 2.0 to you know explode um so if we want to think about um Services uh in in web 3 I think we need to keep it simple and make sure that when somebody is starting anything ad up a consumer CH anything it has to be kept simple that the infrastructure is not a burden the infrastructure is seamlessly being integrated and this is part of my

57. 28:25

    vision that that's that makes sense keep it simple okay um and that's the that's the pretty much the you know um the advice to every entrepreneur coming into crypto is like don't try to do something something more complex but you know you can do something more complex at the back end but just keep it simple in in the front end right because that that makes it yeah um what does excite you guys most than you know like obviously main net is coming um but what are the

58. 28:55

    next steps like what what's you know what's the what excites you most after the main net and uh you know yeah that's that's probably the main the main one I'm kind of curious about as an entrepreneur that you know what's like what's the what's the bigger thing that is you guys are working on after the main launch so um you know I think what what is super interesting is that there there are stages in crypto right um there is the the the the drawboard stages when you are drafting

59. 29:26

    your architecture when you do a couple of experiments and decided what text stack to use there is the second stage which you finally launching the test net and there is the big stage when you do the main Ed right um so actually I think what was interesting with lava is the demand push lava testet to be production uh ready system right so served billions of requests reached two billion uh daily request became a RPC provider of choice in these three amazing

60. 29:59

    ecosystems and um yeah and more ecosystem already wanted to sign you know you see starnet uh filecoin the cosmos Hub stargas Union and so forth and what excites me now is to see the um how the team is kind of uh sending its open source protocol that it works so hard in the last two years and make and and see how that adoption really gets there right I feel like we in this verge

61. 30:31

    of product Market fit a very exciting moment for every entrepreneur to be the adoption is is high the demand is high now execution um so I think I really looking the next few months to see all these new partnership I just mentioned that are going to deploy those pools this is something that um going to bring me a lot of joy and proud of the team of course so what what does product like product Market fit mean for you guys then is it like fullon so you said

62. 31:03

    there's already Demand right like do you think that's that's product Market Fit already or like what is the case that I'm like oh like look I I already have product Market fit I can sleep well now right uh but is there or is there a limit to that right is there always like you delay the product Market fit because you want to achieve more you know more growth I mean this is a personal question but uh how does that work you know is a is

63. 31:26

    a is a fun is a fun uh fun thing to say is like you can never sleep well as an entrepreneur right but uh I'm kind of sleeping not bad uh that's liis been helping you man that's fine you know maybe unrelated to Lava but in general I'm pushing entrepreneurs is to answer the question of what makes their heart sing and if they waking up in the morning with this passion in them when you know they're not snoozing the the alarm and uh they

64. 31:56

    are ready for a new day to conquer the world or bring another step ahead for the product um I think they are in a good place so um yeah in general like um I I I think that the product Market fit is where you see first of all income right uh you see like even in an early stage you see a lot of usage I think there are very interesting kpis inside each and every ecosystem how you how you reach the product Market fit in each ecosystem and the team is working on

65. 32:36

    that non-stop I think uh one interesting stuff is um uh that the protocol itself the foundation was able to distributed hundred thousands of dollars since the beginning of the year right it's real money that came back for um provider that was working really hard on being the best and you kind of think about lava as a distribution channel for all of these providers for example uh you are you are really known as in near right and you have a great technical

66. 33:14

    skills in here you know how to run archive node and stuff like that but what do you have with marketing that right you you can utilize your own infrastructure in order to provide um service and monetize it so if you think about the super user in each ecosystem they can come to Lava spin a what we call a spec that this is the supporting version for each and every ecosystem and everyone can take the spec and Implement their pools provide more nodes and uh provide service so at the

67. 33:52

    end of the day the one who spin up the spec going to get rewards for the entire lifetime of the spec it's another another super cool thing that we call champions in lava um so yeah that's what excites me and that's where I I see the product Market fit making sure that dozens of chain will use lava in the next uh one year yeah okay that's that's cool I mean yeah I I'm pretty sure you guys will get there one of the problems is like as you said uh the RPC providers I've seen it

68. 34:25

    with a lot of things like I was building on on on near and saw rpcs like just die and there's no other alternative to switch to so I think that's there's there's a good I I don't know here cuz we're not chilling right but I remember when Nate from inbase came to me and lava saved the day I was like oh my God thank you so much for saying that it's it's amazing it's amazing because we

69. 34:49

    here to to really make this change but in a new way that also um use the keep it simple principles yeah it's also just aggregating right I'm aggregating that people and you become like a ledger of Ledger of like reliability in a sense that people didn't have before which is which is quite cool I mean it's abstracting not only chains but also services and then you use I mean this this worked in web too right I mean you

70. 35:15

    have bunch of a API aggregators and others and kind of that way and you're doing essentially the same thing but for for crypto and becomes the marketplace and it's interesting it's more fun because you actually have incentives right incentives to kind of get slashed or getting rewards which is not really built in to uh to normal internet so it's it's pretty cool um and what's the

71. 35:39

    um where should people go to learn about you guys like uh what's the what's the best way to kind of get engaged with the community what what could people do to you know be part of lava definitely I think you know uh we our community you know is uh super flourishing especially in the last few months uh go to Discord Twitter um read the blogs and the website um you know the the usual places and socials that every protocol has but I think the team put an immense effort

72. 36:13

    in um in making it uh very coherent uh make it easier I hear providers can just join in a few minutes run nodes and join each and every pools um you know the tooling is great so even if you are non-technical users I I don't know if you've seen the magma point system uh you know what the foundation uh presented in February and since then more than 4 million wallets change the endpoint use lava and started receiving points so um um yeah I think there is a

73. 36:46

    place for this revolution uh for tech people for non te everyone is welcomed and uh yeah we we receiving great feedback so far for the community maybe for entrepreneurs this is a question that I just said when you said points um what was the decision sort of what was your um sort of mental model there when you were actually designing the the the points right I mean what was the you know if you think about it like there's been discussion

74. 37:19

    around obviously like should we do it should we not do it is it overdone like what what's been the feedback from the community for you guys I mean if somebody else is listening on the near Community side I know there bunch of folks that are thinking about doing the same thing like how how would you guide people in in that in that Journey you mean in the Journey of like designing the incentives and points uh yeah I personally was not involved

75. 37:44

    you know it's something that the the foundation was taking um you know more steps in um I uh I was I my core principles was like like how do you you looked at other point systems and um you want to make sure that is actually beneficial and it's easy and it makes sense right cuz what people wants people wants at the end of the day to connect with their narrative to believe in the values that you bring

76. 38:16

    and believe in the vision that you share so uh if you if you are able to make sure the engagement with them is related to your product I think it's a win-win um uh this is how we said from the beginning you know you believe in the values that you should not trust a single provider so no problem you have a decentralized our PC layer if you change your wallet to uh use the endpoint you know something that takes a few minutes

77. 38:51

    um and it's done right it's from that moment you know that you can really have a privacy you know app time availability all all the all the good stuff that the L protocol brings um so you know my uh core um feedback and recommendation just stay connected to the product that you actually developing okay awesome cool but uh this this was very fun so like what are the what are the takeaways I guess what

78. 39:22

    should people learn um you know like if if they listen to this and they kind of came in the last minute and they want to learn more about you yourself lava uh or any any of your vision about chin abstraction like how how would you express that so if you just uh tuned in uh so you know you can reward and go back to the run run an llm and then right technology thing has no da layer or stuff like that uh but I think you know there's a lot of material out

79. 39:53

    outside there you know uh I think our our vision at the beginning was to disrupt the industry in its core fundamental way in in a place that is neglected today and we found out this um um you know very special access layer that everyone at the end of the day needs not even they know that but they need that so I think um like my key takeaway is that you should definitely stay bullish on crypto I'm super excited to see like what kind of um uh the the chain of stru such a narrative is coming

80. 40:28

    and new ways to launching new protocols and uh if at the end of the day you can obstruct away multi-chain RPC it's it's going to bring much more um DBS and user to adopt crypto so um you know mayet live uh and uh I think uh that's the time to be participate and uh help lava grow awesome well thanks thanks Yara for your time this is it's been nice because it's you started with like kind of a little bit about lava how it started what is lava you know the marketplace uh and then the blockchain itself how does it work the old Nar and

81. 41:10

    then kind of a bit more about how chain abstraction helps you guys and also probably everyone else right going forward to to build you know cheaper and faster apps so thanks thanks for your time this has been great Alan thank you for the question I wish you also success in your journey and looking forward to more doing more together awesome