[REDACTED] online Hackathon AMA 3 - Building with AI on NEAR

Captions as YouTube publishes them, usually machine-generated, so product and people names can be misheard.

1. 0:00

   I hello hello everybody Welcome to the third session of the redacted online Marathon AMA session all right we're here today with Cameron Dennis a new y contributor who's been around the New

2. 1:07

   York system for a long time and Joe from near devhub um if you guys want I think we could just jump in or actually say hello introduce yourselves and then I'll jump into some housekeeping go ahead no camon go ahead go ahead go ahead I'm on all the time okay yeah uh my name is Cameron Dennis I've been building a near for almost four years now uh been in crypto for about seven or eight and I'm dedicated

3. 1:33

   to the open web because I don't think that the world is inherently broken I think that the incentive systems that power it are broken and money is the incentive that runs the world and this is the first time in history we can program money so we can program incentives to hopefully make the world a better place and the industries that need you know programmable money the most in my eyes right now where incentives are most broken is around Ai and which is why I'm currently working

4. 1:57

   uh collaborating a lot within your foundation products team on creating this thing called the near AI Hub uh which is an AGG an interactive aggregator of all the AI projects building in the near ecosystem so we have a One-Stop shop to kind of access anything uh that AI Builders Founders and researchers need so I'll dive more into it in a bit but Joe love to hear your intro yeah I'm Joe uh I've been near for a while before I joined uh near

5. 2:23

   devhub devhub is all about actually the developer ecosystem we provide developer support throughout the different channels we ever been through our telegram or Discord uh we also support all the tooling and sdks that are you can build with on here on here so we do a little bit everything else we do some content we have our own set of shows and live streams and all that other fun stuff to learn how to be a better

6. 2:47

   Dev awesome Joe and all right so I'll do a little bit of housekeeping uh so first I want to just point to everyone so devhub after today tomorrow there's going to be a a working session with a team we we got beta doing that right Joe or yes that's who we got tomorrow yes and uh so make sure you check out it's kind of you know AMA is today Thursdays is devhub get really technical on that

7. 3:12

   and uh just a little like what is some of the highlevel info for the redacted online hackathon so first things first I'll pull up a little slide here it has started right the kickoff has started September 5th but that just means it's starting uh you can start submitting projects September 25th and then the final submissions are October 25th now you can start building anytime in

8. 3:36

   between there and uh as Cameron talks about more you'll understand with like AI agent bounties and stuff like that they might only take a couple days to put something together which is really cool or you can spend the whole time larger projects we're almost at 700 devs signed up right now and teams are starting to be built and the judging will be from October 25th to November 8th which will then be an anounced at

9. 4:00

   the redacted IRL movement that happens in Bangkok November 9th through 11th important thing you do not need to go to the IRL event to be part of the online hackathon so there's the online hackathon and then as a bonus as for fun at the IRL event there'll be some bonus bounties and stuff like that some hacking stuff on site but they're separate and uh that's the housekeeping guys so let's jump into I'm gonna start with the first question to you Cameron all right you're on you want to build you're building with near and you want

10. 4:31

    to somehow start with AI this whole near AI where do you begin where do you start well start by solving a problem for somebody is the first goal and um if you are you know depends on what type of AI you're you're really looking to build um I would normally default to things that have to do with web 3 so defi is is a relatively straightforward one within defi there's a lot that you can do um because you know historically agents cannot go create a bank account at Wells Fargo or Chase Bank but they can spin up

11. 5:03

    and manage crypto wallet pretty easily and so managing money trading uh building tools to you know ensure security um for defi transactions I think this is like a huge open market that uh I have seen and will I think continue to see more players come come up because right now in order to make real money in defi you pretty much need the background in finance and to manage imp permanent loss properly to you know manage like uh over collateral isation

12. 5:30

    ratios let's say near dumps or a a token I've been in crypto long enough where I've seen 80% drops in a day um God forbid I have a position in protocol like buau uh and I get liquidated like I would love agents to help me manage my positions uh in a secure way of course and so I do think agents are going to provide a really really great way to democratize access to defi um as long as they're safe and trustworthy and so um there's a whole like Evergreen space to

13. 6:01

    build in that World um and the other like types of verticals that I'm seeing pop up around the Commodities of AI I think of this like as all compute all data and those two things are you know multi-trillion dollar Industries probably over time uh and So within the compute markets a lot of people are tokenized a compute creating derivatives from these tokenized compute like from

14. 6:23

    this tokenized compute um data is a again a whole another thing where you have data monetization Networks data labeling networks um data pipelines the AI agents need data and so where is this data coming from it needs to be cleaned properly um so to be honest I kind of see AI as like a whole stack of different technology that we're going to need to kind of address piece by piece and this is why we're building this

15. 6:48

    Interactive Hub um it's because it's really confusing and so when you say build AI uh it's a can of wormstone pack and so uh I hope hope that provides some clarity but obviously there there's more to talk about yeah totally Joe if you want to jump in on this I'm just going to say the recap that I got is like so basically data compute those are like the two super important things of AI and then you've got all sorts of creating an

16. 7:10

    agent benchmarking stuff like that so Joe if you want to jump in and actually before joke goes I'm so sorry we got the Commodities a compute uh data and we have like the agent Frameworks which I think of just all the tooling all the middleware and that's where people can build better tools to build better agents um and then we have the agents themselves that are pretty much built within the Frameworks using the tools

17. 7:33

    and so if you're trying to build AI figure out where you want to be in that stack you want to build friend users build agents you want to build Dev tools fantastic you want to build infrastructure do that but you know different things required different subject matter expertise yeah no I I I like that opening statement a lot because I think AI when the initial concept of AI becomes intimidating for a lot of people

18. 7:59

    right and the I think when most of the time when you talk to even I would say experienced devs they say I can't do AI because I don't know how to program a model I don't know how to right I don't know neural networks I haven't done machine learning and so they feel like that it's away from them but like as you just stated it's so much more that goes into the larger AI picture than just

19. 8:24

    programming models so let's kind of jump in a little bit and so from a hackathon perspective here where does where would you suggest someone just kind of starts if like is it finding that category first for them is that what where you would suggest like when you're having conversation with Dev like is it figure out like what category do I best fit in it's a great question um and let me

20. 8:54

    also be clear I'm generally talking to Pro like Founders who already know what want build um and I'm kind of walking through their n Journey so I'm not speaking to as many kind of early early developers in the space if I were to I would say well go to redacted Dev post page and check out the bounties and because all these different people who are listing bounties you know are solving different parts of the stack so I would start there look at all these different parts of the stack if you're interested in building agents check out

21. 9:26

    the the B agent uh AI AG plug-in Bounty that you know I think they have over $15,000 to create these agents that plug into their wallet that so you're essentially getting access to all their distribution really quickly um if you're trying to do something like a token staking agent what I mean by that is you type into the you know the text box saying hey agent I would like to stake

22. 9:50

    five near and then transaction thing pops up and then if you are really trying to better understand how key management works as well like you're going to have to figure that out out uh through near account model and near docs describes all of this at least not the AI component but like how to manage access keys and so um that's if you want to build like kind of consumer facing agents uh potluck provides a really

23. 10:14

    great set of bounties and a really good ideas honestly that's where um I would recommend people to check out the most at first at least they've done a really good job specking out all these really cool ideas on how to better fund public goods with agents and so um I can just drop a link in this chat if that's helpful uh so more ideas on that front again this is all like on the agent Builder side of things if you're interested in like you know different like data pipelines Zeta blocks is a fantastic uh company and

24. 10:46

    product and so using their data sets is a great place to start depending on what kind of Agents you're looking to build uh they have a lot of really accurate uh blockchain data as well as uh some super solid like fraud detection models so again if you're interested in like def5 security or anything like that like check out the Zeta blocks Bounty Quest flow again I'm more on the

25. 11:09

    agent side of things um and the reason why agents are easier to build in hackathons is because you don't need to stand up giant compute networks and data labeling networks it's like a huge lift that's pretty much only done by companies that have a lot of resources um but Quest flow is an agent orchestration layer so if you want to get one agent to connect with another agent to do another thing like that's a perfect platform to work with um and so

26. 11:32

    they have $2,000 dedicated to uh in usdt for the best agents that can plug to other agents within their Network and these are web two agents not everything needs to just be interacting with you know the blockchain it doesn't really make sense a lot of the times um so if you want to let's say have your agent uh buy a plane ticket with usdc like how would you actually do that well you're going to need usdc to have your your you know your wallet connect to some sort of off- ramping

27. 12:03

    agent that then actually like goes and off-ramps your money into some sort of bank account and then some sort of like bank ID actually banks are tough I don't think you'll be able to do this really easily but um this is why this hackcon exists is to experiment with this um to then go buy that plane ticket just with your agents these agents are gonna have to talk to each other and so that's Quest flow I can go on and on uh Valerie and Olas network is super cool uh they

28. 12:29

    have like a lot of uh neat prediction Market agents uh essentially trying to guess the future of certain decisions uh in the real world I know poly markets got really popular um definitely check that out they have a whole agent development framework they have amazing education materials honestly that's probably where I'd start first if you're like looking to learn how to build um Olas I'm just going to pull it up real

29. 12:53

    quick uh yeah really really good uh like Hands-On example apps and everything to start building agents so that's a good place to start it's called Olas Academy I'll drop the link here in the chat uh they have podcasts they have pretty much everything uh I mean there's so much stuff to do frankly uh but I'm happy to dive into more of these things if you want no I look I think this is I love

30. 13:21

    the whole way that first off these are coming out in different areas it's really highlighting again how much goes into Ai and the part that like we've been trying to stress in other events whether it's through some of our our devhub streams which actually we we had uh poock on talking about you know we had plug come on and talk about you know really what actually you know public

31. 13:43

    good funding AIS can look like we actually broke down some of the ideas so go back and check out the devhub live episode uh really explains a lot of that but in general I I think from a hackathon perspective what again we said last time on this episode but I'll say again here you have so much time you have like almost 6 weeks here now and like five more weeks right something like that maybe more than that I guess six more week and like take that time like try some stuff really dig into it and like come and ask questions because

32. 14:16

    the beauty of a project sponsoring a bounty is that you have somebody clear-cut to go talk to and ask questions too and I really encourage developers to go uh do that don't just be in the dark of all that stuff let's um let's go a little bit um um further into it and just kind of talk about some of the process that you are when you're having conversations with these projects and they're starting to

33. 14:46

    build on blockchain okay so we'll leave the concept of near outside but just blockchain in general where is that discussion coming from is it mostly around the financial piece the account the data where do you see a lot of that conversation go yeah it's primarily around incentives and so you know money incentivizes people to do things uh it's kind of what you know made Bitcoin work is solving the double spend Problem by paying minors and so I I think that this is like the whole point of crypto obviously

34. 15:19

    blockchains are really good for ensuring data is immutable and you know there forever but uh overall I would say most of these projects are leveraging crypto in some way to incentivize certain Behavior whether that is uh to get people to build more agents or for people to get paid to I mean that's another use case but is using money to incentivize people to to label data like public AI um that is super clear I don't know if uh the audience knows but like this is actually the reason why near got

35. 15:50

    built like near got built originally like the protocol was a side project of a side project of a side project quite frankly um to pay people around the world to label data to train large language models and needed to be easy to use it needed to scale it needed to be you know browser native it's a web assembly based and so uh now we have all these other companies that are now doing

36. 16:13

    this and this was back in 2017 2018 um which the idea really kind of came to Fric and so uh yeah like we're seeing more of this so people are using crypto to pay people and then also you need to verify somehow that the data that you're getting back is actually useful and so there's a lot of game theory involved where money is a fantastic tool for someone to stake a certain amount of

37. 16:36

    near or whatever asset in order to if if they do provide faulty data they get slashed and that type of incentive mechanism wasn't really possible without crypto and so um being really creative around Game Theory and incentive systems honestly is the I think the superpower of crypto so U yeah I would say a lot of it's primarily around incentives um and yeah I mean that's that's kind of to me the whole gist yeah no that's that's great um and

38. 17:09

    one of the things that we've been trying to encourage too as you know and from even Dev hub's perspective as we go towards more web 2 type developers it's not just about um you know Finding crypto natives the part of that we try to instill is that you don't have to bring in the whole blockchain stack into your project right away it's sometimes it's taking a piece of that whether

39. 17:34

    again it is the financial incentive piece whether it's the account model um pieces like that just from a a larger I guess uh from your own larger experience not just an AI but is that something where again just from your own experience where that transition probably makes more sense for people instead of always trying to shove everything in I afraid that that developers sometimes get o overwhelmed

40. 18:00

    intimidated by I got to go full full web three right like but so there not always that way correct it's more about verifiability um it's about verifiability and transparency and transparency is just a sort of feature of verifiability in my eyes and so um yeah I mean this is where you do not and you should not store everything on chain it is expensive it is slow it is it's not ideal you can post a hash to something that can be validated uh

41. 18:31

    onchain but all the actual data sits offchain and so this is where like you might not want all you know all the agent logic inside of a smart contract like that doesn't make sense like you're not you're not GNA do that you're not going to train llms on chain uh that's not does make sense or you know people are trying to uh incentivize people to run gpus in order to kind of crowdsource

42. 18:57

    you know training or inference uh for for calling AI but uh it's sometimes we still need a lot of improvements to be totally honest uh again that's just incentives you're just it's really for payments uh for putting other everything else on chain I actually recommend people to put as little on chain as possible uh to cut cut cost and make it simple because also let me be clear here

43. 19:21

    like a lot of these AI developers don't love crypto um they just want to they're starting to see the the benefit of agent agent payments in a permissionless way again it's about incentives it's about like okay if one agent needs to pay an agent for something else like they're not going to be using Swift and you know even stripe for that matter they're gonna be using crypto it's much more permissionless it's much faster it's much it's just more straightforward um so I definitely see

44. 19:52

    that there's going to be in terms of what goes on chain is pretty much just payments and like attest for verifiability y and so the term that we hear a lot here near is user owned you know X right so user owned data whatever how does that narrative fit into everything else yeah so user owned in my eyes is is more about Edge models and local development or local local models so in a perfect world and you're gonna take some time to get there uh but everyone should just have everything on

45. 20:30

    their phone pretty much like air gapped and you are only you have your model pretty much at Birth that is being trained on all your personal data instead of everything being sent to the cloud um and that should frankly not leave your phone unless you provide very very clear sort of uh like confirmation that it should and if we have super intelligence Run the World which I'm actually seeing this become more and more reality every day uh we need a way to verify our money data and governance

46. 21:01

    I.E our digital sovereignty uh if someone can very rapidly just like create a fake version of Joe or you know it Society can like the social fabric of society can be at risk if um we don't own our Monday dinner governance own a world control by super intelligence like this this actually scares me um yeah so I would say user owned is less about everything on chain because that's public and everything that you you do not want public uh it's actually about having it be local on your phone or your

47. 21:34

    desktop or your laptop um with certain verifiable credentials or attestations that can be checked on chain yeah yeah great great great synopsis there where the the part of the verification on chain is really probably the more important piece out of all of this then right again it's not about definitely don't put on data definitely put your personal stuff on the Chain cuz there is something where again if you're newer to

48. 22:05

    crypto and building here uh it's an important distinction that even though there is cryptography being used here your data is not encrypted and so like if you can just go on chain and see what's happening so that's where again I it's it is about using the different parts of the chain as a tool as you're trying to build out your project and think thinking about what that is J do you have a question you want to jump in before is see you thinking up there yeah so I'm I'm I'm reading some stuff on here right

49. 22:38

    also I'm trying to get socials out so if you guys notice I'm like diving in trying to make sure people can you know part of my gig but um so here's what I'm wondering so there's able to stack bounties right like this whole redacted hackathon we can stack bounties so you could be building some sort of project like heavily using like the near awesome account structure right you can be building something with that then you could also stack an AI bounty on top of

50. 23:02

    that when you think about those kind of things Cameron do you think that's like how it works like you can just sort of be like okay we want to create a project and then within that project have an AI agent which is kind of like a API I'm guessing and just build something that can get the data for a project very easily or something like that oh my God yeah so I mean I have this little graph of like where near has

51. 23:25

    been and where it's going uh okay I can send to pull it up real quick send telegram I'll share it or send it to yeah way mean what's the best way to do this um so pretty much it starts with like we needed to build a protocol that can handle real demand like that is step one we cannot have a crypto Kitty moment where we promise the open web and then all of a sudden we need l2s like that's

52. 23:49

    just not it's no point no um so then the second piece is we need to make sure we we check that box uh we generally have here it's actually like my entire deck so I could just send you this to oh it's your if you want to share your screen I can just give you access and you can share and control yourself yeah that great that'd be great um actually I can do it right here um so there you go let me know when you want me to bring it up all right yeah

53. 24:15

    you can bring it up so yeah um the tldr is you we need to prove that we can actually handle real demand so we started working with a lot of web 2 organizations that really benefit from web three you know making a historically illiquid asset more liquid like us like sweatcoin where your sweatcoins were only exchangeable for yoga pants and shoes but now you can turn it into usdc and off-ramp it or you

54. 24:40

    know kai which is loyalty programs where they just wanted to actually have a fast settlement layer that's you know cheaper than what they were previously using and that's why near is great it was save them money um hot telegram wallet it's because nears web a sem based and we have an amazing account model that allows you to create wallets and actually store private keys locally on your phone that's incredible so use blockchains to engage your users so we

55. 25:04

    check this box this is a little old so bear with me here but when I did take the screenshot on July 9th uh near had 10.96 million weekly active users this was pretty much our goal to prove that the L1 can handle real demand sh the network and sure state is uh going to be cheap blockchain is fast but really if we want to get to Mass adoption we need chain obstruction we need so you as a user shouldn't have to have an AWS account to

56. 25:35

    go use Snapchat or an Azure account to go to the 7-Eleven up the street and buy a candy bar like that's never going to work so we need it so you don't have to care what blockchain your favorite application is deployed to you just use an application and so this is a whole stack which is why people get so confused in web 3 they're like near is doing everything like near trying to do da near doing accounts near doing

57. 26:01

    decentralized front ends I'm like well yeah because this is all the different parts of chain abstraction in order to make it invisible so you don't have to care about using a blockchain because currently like I used to teach uh like I run a nonprofit we start blockchain development courses at universities and I would teach a course to seniors in computer science uh at some top tier

58. 26:25

    schools like UCLA and UC Santa Barbara where seniors and computer science will lose their keys in the same Workshop like if they can't manage their keys in the same Workshop like this industry is cooked right so how do we actually you know move Beyond this and it's through this the one thing to answer your question uh Jared like super clearly is use chain signatures to build multi-chain agents where you don't need to your agent's not going to care what

59. 26:57

    blockchains deployed to it's a freaking agent they all they care about is going where liquidity is and where users are so enable chain signatures for your agent to sign transactions across any chain and now you're opening up huge opportunities for your users and quite frankly if you do this successfully you can probably go raise money and like build a formal company around this like chain signatures is so new and I'll drop

60. 27:22

    this GitHub repo in the in the in the chat just so people can have it um but this is really cool it's essentially for those you might not know it's a programmable NPC Network for when when you you create a your account you'll simultaneously create accounts across all these other blockchains that support the same uh cryptographic signatures ecdsa to be specific there's a few others I believe um and you're able to

61. 27:44

    sign transactions on these other accounts with one wallet instead of having to spin up another wallet on another chain with another seed phrase and a whole another thing and so now you hand this wallet to an agent and now it's able to transact across all these networks this is really cool and so now we can finally if we check the chain abstraction box focus on the thing that y Year got built to begin with which is user own Ai and user own internet so um

62. 28:10

    hopefully Jared to simply answer your question is use chain signatures to build AI agents chain abstracted agents dude that's such a that's the line of this dude use chain signatures to create multi-chain AI agents that's like there you go like that's like what yeah that's awesome dude that's going to be the the tweet from this freaking event or this AMA man so that's cool and you to go support I'm talking to one of these teams that's not building with chain signatures they have to support 111

63. 28:42

    chains right what the what the hell like what is going on and like integrate One support everything it's super straightforward yeah it's I don't think people understand what it really actually starts to unlock to of when you start to build that way because when everything is controlled through this initial account on near and now you can start to go to all these other chains you can really pretty much start writing your code once be able to have it

64. 29:18

    everywhere and actually bring in not just the liquidity but users and you're simplifying all of that cuz like you said you know it's the user experience really the end of the day has to be seamless and they do not care for the most part besides the people who are already here and who are Maxis or whatever else forget those people Everyone Else the real the regular users do not care where things are located how it's done it just has to work it's the

65. 29:49

    same as we use any other software today and so this really unlocks so many opportunities CU you're not riant on something being built just here on near there are some chains that are doing certain things maybe better or different and you can unlock and use all of that within your product all the same way all right let me jump in on from a I'm a non so for people listening like I I do a lot of content and marketing and stuff and Joe and I have worked together and I've known Cameron so I'm not highly Dev

66. 30:21

    technical by any means I mean Joe you have been very kind at some of the questions I've asked you and you've answered them so I do appreciate it sprinkle API on it yeah so some yeah sprinkle sprinkle an API I'm always like can't we just like sprinkle some AI on that he'll be like no that's not how it works but here's my question from a Dev point of view when you build on near and you build using chain signatures and

67. 30:43

    you're leveraging some more of the like Tech stack that is near it can still work with other chains like you could still be building on other chains but there just leveraging the near aspects and then you don't have to like copy paste adjust for every single chain right right is that kind of like yeah I mean like let's say and let's say right now like you are building on polygon you're building on

68. 31:07

    some eth L2 whatever else I already have this stuff I already built I buil put these contracts already else but there is no other chain that has great of an account model as near right the account model here is is second to none and so when you think of you say okay I really want to use near account model because I can do so much with that I can really do you know I want to have people sign up with their socials or whatever it might

69. 31:31

    be and now they can come in they can do that and you can still have all your stuff that you already built like you can now transition now you're leveraging all these different pieces of it yeah so it's and it opens up like liquidity because I can go across multiple chains at once uh and now the biggest one here which we talked a lot about in the last AMA is it unlocks Bitcoin to really

70. 31:55

    actually be a chain that you can program against right a chain that does not have Smart contracts there but now you can actually build Logic on top of it using chain signatures all right that that's awesome and it it basically seems like in all of web 3 you've got a lot of people incentivized to build in certain places that's sort of like the game over the past few years but as more Builders come

71. 32:19

    into the space they're gonna choose the most cost effective and biggest audience they can reach with this like the least amount of time I think that's where this seems to make a lot of sense because why wouldn't you I mean yeah if you're a maxer you're paid to be a maxi or something like that but otherwise n seems to play really well with others you could still be a maxi to some degree right you could still say like I

72. 32:43

    really I really love eth I want to continue to do stuff there but you know I want to I want the flexibility that as I hopefully scale I can scale to the things I can open up I can unlock walk so much more in the future just future planning you know like if you are a project and you are thinking about my my road map and I say how am I going to get from A to B to C and I want to especially if I'm going to go try to raise money I need to show how I'm going to grow I need to show I'm going to

73. 33:15

    bring in bigger audiences I mean this the the part with chain signatures makes a ton of sense and now you put the ability to build an AI agent on top of that like now you have this combo that really again I hate to keep using the word unlock but like it does like it just opens up so many more doors for you as a builder that's cool this this episode is now turning into explain near to a normi

74. 33:45

    DJ yeah well I love to have this one graphic that to be clear I did not make um I stole it from somebody uh probably someone at near foundation and um it's if you see my slides um it's near as like you have this option for modular or monolithic you can only use like you can just pick to you know store blob data using like near da if you want or as Joy's highlighted you can just use chain signatures to access like nearest flexible account model or you can just

75. 34:17

    store your JavaScript front end in a nearest Smart contract to decentralize it to ensure redundancy forever pay one time font and stored Forever on chain that's really cool but you can still have your contracts live on polygon ckvm or arbitrum or wherever and so this to me is like the whole point um we shouldn't have to care if you know your front end is stored on ipfs or near or your contracts are on salana or near

76. 34:48

    like it just it just works and so uh yeah I just really love this graphic of like you have the option you can just do everything on near monolithic or you have modular um so yeah evm devs come come through the time has come oh yeah the evm stuff's really cool that's coming out in the next couple months too and this is sorry I was this is maybe again more on the technical side of it but I think it's important to highlight is that if you have been building software for a little while

77. 35:22

    like that you know modular and monolithic thing has come even comes from web to right of like how does everything structured for you this is not a New Concept and again when you are planning you're in those planning stages now even for a hackathon there there are considerations where here you have more time so you're going to probably build a little bit bigger of a project you can start to think about again what solution

78. 35:47

    makes more sense to you you are not locked into a particular setup in order to achieve whatever you're going for so it's really important that developers of any level when they're making their project really say hey I can actually consider all of these options when I'm working on near that you maybe can't do when you're working just singularly on another chain sorry j i kind of cut you off there oh not at all man I'm just listen I don't want to I don't want to distract

79. 36:22

    too much like this is this is I want devs to really get a lot out of this and I you know so that that's not at all uh Cameron do we want to dive into a couple other projects that are doing that are part of this Ai and stuff like that like like where does Masa with their data come in in their socials like right like in my mind I want to create an llm with my socials and then do cool things with that agent like is this is are we at this place yet where someone

80. 36:45

    like can do that yeah yeah straightforward um it's this is where like we're trying to make that whole process much easier through a interactive aggregator I.E The Hub but right now you can go to Masa you can you know connect your socials you can kind of like I guess uh I've not done this myself so just to be clear I have not done this but I'm going through their docs right now and you can click build quick start guide make it all happen um and I think you would qualify yeah this

81. 37:18

    should qualify you at least if it doesn't I will do what I can to change that uh for the AI track and so if you don't see a bounty there there that you know asks you to use Mosa's uh you know data then screw it do it anyway and apply for a different track yeah totally what I'm W to for the next few minutes we want to just bring up some of these projects like can look at like so people know where they're going let's bring up the Masa website let's just talk about it like right like they got interviewed and um I can help

82. 37:51

    like don't worry I will be like putting all sorts of links in the followup on this but on the near AI office hours where Ilia and Alex talk to all these AI projects it's where I've learned everything from AI like I'm totally AI pilled whatever that's called I'm like after 16 episodes of that I'm like oh shoot AI is no joke right yeah and uh Masa was on there one of our most viewed episodes so and it's all data they got a big community so like you know they're

83. 38:16

    doing you know they're going to be part of this like GI some bounties so they they do data right like we can just spend like a minute on this like Joe what do you think like developer guide like yeah I think I mean the the place obviously to start for with Dev I think they're also most comfortable jumping into like the documentation and just kind of seeing what's there and getting a sense of what's possible and as

84. 38:39

    Cameron said like you know you you can jump into this and see does it fit into the category and if not again it all this all can tie together because you can stack bounties and pull things in like you know don't get discouraged but I mean as soon as you dive in and you start to see like here's the data Network and look again I mean you don't have to be an AI developer these are

85. 39:03

    this are just standard API rest apis that I can call and I'm I'm of and running uh you know and that's a really cool thing to just kind of dive into that's awesome and then uh so that's one of the projects so people can go here and start getting some ideas and and another thing we're going to be doing a deep dive you know with all these projects coming on here and they can like chat so it's like good to start getting in that and you're really going to start to get to like see who's running these projects so you have that one uh do we want to do we could pull up

86. 39:37

    uh the Bas right how do you say it in German it's is it b or bet do you guys know I always go back it's B okay I don't speak German but yes I believe it's B but I think it's like origin for that so now you've got this whole team right so they're doing a lot of uh AI agents right so if you think they're almost kind of at like the like top of funnel of Agents as well right and so when I think of them they've got like Primitives and plugins right so they might have a plug-in with like a ref

87. 40:07

    finance a Pikes Peak uh it could be other things like uh cross chain where it's like Arbitrage bot and stuff so I know that they're aiming for that so you could in theory make a defi AI agent right that could use the ref Finance plugin and do all sorts of things right Cameron I am I kind of thinking of this how way I yes it's the whole idea is like composable kind of connect everything together you don't have to build

88. 40:39

    everything from scratch like some of it's already there for you ultimately at the end of the day is to make user experience better like make it less complex for people to manage their positions in their pools make sure that they're not suffering from a permanent loss and if they are hey there's a little like popup saying you know you're about to be liquidated or you know not liquidated like you're you're losing

89. 41:04

    money like the spread is changing like maybe suggest pouring putting more usdc in your pool or taking it out and backing out like there is a lot that needs to be built in order to make defi easier uh because I think I said earlier like you borderline need a background in finance to make money in it uh well and if you don't know it you're if you don't know where the liquidity is coming from

90. 41:29

    you're the liquidity uh and so this is something that I feel like def agents can really help with and these these templates are a fantastic place to start you don't need to build everything you can just be only you know creating a template only to identify impermanent loss in dra pools right like that's a hell of a packathon project like you may win if you do that uh if it solves a real problem for yeah

91. 42:00

    no I I you know you you're I don't even know if you know you're doing it you're giving so many good like hackathon advice things here like it just every time you say something I think of it like and so I want to make sure we're highlighting it but like you don't have to code everything from scratch like like like that is that is not going to work for you you don't get bonus prizes for coding everything by hand uh so like

92. 42:24

    take advantage of the stuff cuz really what a hackathon is most of the time but especially this one is about productizing stuff in a way that like this is solving a problem and so if solving a problem means I need some of this from over here I need a little bit of you know this from bit I'm going pull some data for Masa I'm going to then also do some of my own code and I'm going to pull everything together and now I have this really cool thing like that's super powerful and that's a more

93. 42:54

    likely to be like you said get a prize and someone who just tries to code something from scratch that there's no there's no bonus points in that yeah and I think the bay thing because we're gonna be doing a tomorrow you're actually doing a workshop it's called Teach Joe with demo we're gonna have a lot of these projects actually come on and they're going to teach you how to do these things and hopefully people can make that that'll be tomorrow

94. 43:20

    at noon correct Joe you're at no 4m. UTC noon Eastern yep yeah that'll be huge because then it's like you know the bitto with the wallet connect you know you could have a cool thing where you basically like you open a wallet you type a prompt then the agent runs or then a runtime starts an agent runs and then it like can execute right like you could do all sorts of cool things where that agent could trade on social stuff

95. 43:44

    for fun like there's all sorts of things I'm starting to see but um so that's really cool so uh should we go is there anything else you want to add here yeah pag jer. near every time near Foundation or near to call Twitter hit above X like you can do a lot how do we do that all right every or pull money here's the Wallet account if it doesn't hit next oh yeah that'd be that's like

96. 44:12

    pretty cool like but yeah so that's the B one right so um let's look at some what so we've got okay so I think the which one you want to look up that potlock I want I want to flag on beta because like what's really cool about working with is they have distribution if you build with them you have access to users if you're building something from scratch you are so you are you are you are out of luck you need to go get your own users yeah you can work with

97. 44:43

    these platforms that already have distribution that's insane like that's not normal work with them like that it's so straight your first five customers your first get if you're at a hackathon and you can actually get somebody to pay you for an agent by the time the hackathon ends and by the way you still have about five weeks so like you have plenty of time you you have a much higher chance of winning compared to

98. 45:08

    some person who built everything from scratch y most might not even work in the demo you know like build on top of other people's stuff as because it's all open source and that's kind of the point and get real distribution if you get customers I can almost guarantee that you'll get prizes like it it's it's it's not rocket science there's very few people in general yeah yeah and this

99. 45:32

    team will help you I mean you you'll have several people from the team help guide you on these things it's like not like we just like hey come build and you're on your own I mean if you're leveraging one of these projects they're absolutely going to help you so that's sort of like I think the hack if I were if I were gonna start that jump into a hackathon that's where I would go totally um awesome so that's a bit uh

100. 45:54

     tomorrow awesome teach Joe workshop with them uh let's roll what about to um Valerie here we can do that one sure let's jump into that here we go yeah Val it's this one right yeah if you're building any sort of like defi agents or honestly just looking to learn so the company the so Olas is the protocol Olas is the is the thing um so you'll be building on the Olas protocol uh Valerie

101. 46:26

     is just an entity that supports the Olas development and growth um and so the with with Olas you are able to essentially build agents that can trade and can trade on your behalf and do pretty much as complex trading as you would want now the interesting thing about trading uh is that agent trading is not new um hedge funds have been doing it for a very very very long time there's a multi- probably trillion

102. 46:56

     dollar business uh built on Bots trading now the difference is that we are now able to do this with permissionless money very much more easily and kind of copy strategies build on top of other strategies it's pretty cool um specifically around like uh let's see uh their their uh prediction Market protocol is extra cool I know like U po Market's getting a ton of attention recently so how can you actually have an agent like maybe even

103. 47:30

     guess what's going to happen based on certain inputs and like put money in and like bet on it now it's interesting because to me a little bit it kind of you know part of the benefit of these PR prediction markets is that like you're getting human sentiment uh not just like agent sentiment but if agent sentiment is actually pulling from a bunch of human sentiment you're playing

104. 47:54

     a different game so I suggest playing around with it and the best part about uh Olas is they do have incredible education so definitely check out that that education uh they have like entire tutorials courses um great docs like they've done a killer job on that side so Jo there's a whole there a whole Academy videos here and what it means I mean they really looks like they've done a ton of work here on

105. 48:24

     this that's great that's great all right who basically Trad sorry they don't currently support N I want to be clear here um collaborating with them and making that happen slowly bit surely but um doesn't matter like these things are all going to be chain abstracted anyway so go and experiment and absolutely work with h us like they're great yeah no that's awesome uh where do we want to jump next

106. 48:57

     uh we could go to the well we've got Zeta block is doing a bounty uh we just so Zeta block I make sure to put the link in though right up on this they just did a whole AI office hours where they Dove deep with Ilia and Alex and got really into it so I mean there's a whole like you can watch that like if you're building in this hacker line you can watch that stream learn a lot and then go from there but um Cameron do you

107. 49:21

     want to add a little bit to uh Zeta blocks like I don't like yeah I love this team they're awesome um they've got really good data and anyone who likes AI it all startes with data so um if you want to let's say they they have this this bounty here build a blockchain live news Digest agent uh ask AMA so pretty much a have a an agent that is able to answer any question that you have about a protocol like what chain has the highest volume in the last five minutes um this is like real time this

108. 49:56

     is really cool uh especially if you're trying to do like Arbitrage like real-time Arbitrage uh again there's like many ways that you can take this you can do like hardcore trading agents with the Zeta block because they have real-time data or you can do more like historical analysis um like oh pull me up the every point in time in which the poly Market polls were uh went from 100% and the next day to 5%

109. 50:27

     and like what happened in those days and like how what were those switches how many times has that actually happened in the US political you any poll tagged politics across this period of time um and create agents around this like this is really neat and actually I think tells a really cool story about the society at large if poly Market continues to grow which actually it will

110. 50:49

     not Financial advice not legal advice do not take anything what I say uh yeah but it's it's it's cool and you can use use their data to do these things fraud detection holy crap huge imagine all the all the wallets who get rugged and what we can do if we were to say hey like you're interacting with a wallet that has rugged in the past or it has received it the vast majority of money

111. 51:14

     in that account came from another wallet that has rugged this is really important to keep this industry safe yeah well and I was thinking like for any because a project that's already building can build in this hackathon they can add things to their project in the hackathon you can be building in like on polygon and do something with chain abstraction and win a bounty in this hackathon right you can add an AI agent so like that would be

112. 51:38

     something interesting where you could add an AI agent for your project especially if you're dealing with anything on the back end and you could Source some data that way I think that fraud projection is really cool maybe find a way to say like this wallet is like you could you could almost have like a score ranking with the wallets and if the agent deems it to be like a grade D versus grade A or something you know could be cool stuff to really use data to sort of parse out that kind of

113. 52:02

     stuff and if you have a project you're kind of just adding to your project anyway with a hackathon yeah I mean and for those who maybe missed it uh you do not have to start with a fresh project for this so you can continue to build on your current project as part of the hackathon so integrating Solutions like this um I think again what's impressive every website we've pulled up has been full of

114. 52:27

     resources the documentation all there uh this is great this has uh data recipes it has some pre-built apis already um you know extensive documentation uh there's no reason why you shouldn't at least check this out to see if it fits into your project and now you know maybe you're submitting an AI project all of a sudden so very cool yeah uh should we bring up Quest flow because I want to know Cameron so this a okay so there's when you start getting into AI like there's like four stages of

115. 53:01

     AI right like you you first time you see it it's like magic then you start to get into like the like oh this is makeing me a 10x better like person you start you know stacking subscriptions then that next stage you're like whoa all right and this is where I think like sort of this multi-agent world gets where you start to have some real questions like okay in theory it's going to be like I'm going to have a clone agent that will then talk to agents and I won't even talk to the agents and then like that

116. 53:26

     are we at that space yet in AI or is this more early stage this is your AI executive assistant there you go I guess yeah I mean that that is the goal um and their goal is to get more people to build these agents that do this well and can kind of perform certain functions um oh can you hear me yeah yeah okay great yeah so um yeah there's $2,000 on the table for anyone who builds the best agent for Quest FL like this is so broad like everyone

117. 53:58

     should submit for this uh and also by the way they have like it's web to pretty much like they have like zapier connections and so you can get as creative as possible like oh I need a you know air table for every I don't know like you do so much uh like look at all stuff I want to summarize every YouTube link every YouTube video that mentions uh that is published by these universities that mentions uh formal verification using llms like it's and you can pull from

118. 54:37

     YouTube you can summarize it you can put it in a table you know and I want to pay you know uh some GitHub account and actually I love to see uh more this is actually more like the potluck public goods side of things um but like drips network is a way to pay GitHub repos in crypto uh where they can just like claim uh a certain amount of whatever money gets donated to them at some point uh and so I like see this interaction

119. 55:06

     should we bring up the potlock as our final one for this sure yeah we could talk okay because potlock yeah this team is awesome um they just have ideas like it's ideas and ideas and ideas and ideas because as I was saying earlier like the whole point of crypto is to incentivize certain behavior and there there's a lot of behavior in the world that needs to be incentivized so um how do we create agents that like write rfps very well or

120. 55:34

     you know identify a project that uh has provided a lot of value to the ecosystem that hasn't been rewarded yet based on certain sentiment uh you know there's like just click like scroll down a little bit like there's so many ideas that this team has taking the time to write out oh whoa you yeah no it's it's uh it's all yeah d M agents like we're literally handing things on a silver platter to you de like the developers here that want to

121. 56:03

     build it's very very very strict this agent thing I mean I I I know like you know there's web 3 and there's agents and I think there's a definite strong intersection because I think you know crypto is the currency of AI right like like you're saying like these agents are gonna there's gonna be an AI Commerce economy going on behind the scenes that we'll all never as humans even know that's going on and they're going to be trans ing value back and

122. 56:27

     forth in ways that like we can't even comprehend right and so I think this is like really cool because as these AI agents start getting made and people start understanding that you can get value from them I just think it's GNA start to take off like like anything you know it's like early days of any social networking is gonna get replaced with agent networks right like and this team uh wasn't able to

123. 56:53

     list a bounty for this hackathon this time around but um they're called nevermind they are awesome you talk about AI commerce think there's a whole company building around this and big fan of never mind team Yep this is this is gonna be very very lit um so yeah give that a look they're not lising Bounty this time around but they're awesome keep keep your eye on them yeah absolutely any other AI projects people keep their eye on that they they could think about and then um we can wrap it

124. 57:21

     up how do you how's that sound for everyone I me there's a lot but Joe are you gonna say something uh no I just uh real quick on the uh potluck thing again uh devhub live episode 18 if you search for that in YouTube uh you can see plug break it all down we go through the ideas talks all about how it actually can be built why all that stuff so and again it's right there for you if you need an idea uh to jump right into it awesome um all right so Cameron any

125. 57:55

     last things that you to share before we kind of yeah CL um so tomorrow at 11 a.m. Pacific we'll be running honestly a very similar Workshop to this but with a lot of the founders from these other teams um and so I dropped a Luma here in the in our share chat we have uh representatives from Zeta blocks representative from metap pool never mind potlock we're all hanging out in a zoom for about an hour and a half uh with an amazing Community called 100 100x devs and this is all

126. 58:28

     happening tomorrow so feel free to join it's uh generally kind of private but whoever's stayed this long is welcome so well what I'll do is I'll do a recap on this because uh we'll post the link I don't know we we'll talk because I'll just drop the link in like a post but if you want to be kind of private let's let's talk yeah I you need to work on permissioning so no one Zoom bombs

127. 58:52

     that's the that's the main thing you just have like 1500 people show up to this that'd be awesome but there will be there will probably be hundreds of people yeah nice awesome cool so uh Joe um anything that you want to kind of like share with some devs to like wrap it up as well no really I think you know we covered a lot I mean again this is a great example of how much flexibility

128. 59:17

     you have in this this hackathon uh don't be scared of AI uh there's a lot of good stuff to do with it and build with it uh we're you know we're promoting it in devhub lives as well and yeah keep asking question keep keep reaching out uh everybody here wants to help and everyone's new in building so don't be shy about any of this stuff cool Cameron anything last words yeah no follow follow me on

129. 59:46

     Twitter I guess it's Cameron y nice out awesome and then I'll just say just make sure are like the things I take away from this from a a non-de perspective is one it's definitely you got plenty of time to do bigger projects Joe like you said but then also if you want to get into the like AI agent hacking aspect of this you've got more than enough time to even start two if you currently have a project on another chain you can add to it and do stuff on this so that's also okay you don't you could you can start you can have a

130. 1:00:21

     current project and still enter and add to that project with like chain signatures or some chain abstraction aspect or AI agents right and then I think the third one is that the defi aspect of AI agents is really interesting Cameron thank you for shouting that out the data aspect and um those are the main things that I get and um well thank you guys for joining and until next time uh tomorrow do the uh

131. 1:00:48

     bit devhub teach me and also Cameron's event as well so thank you everyone have a great day and uh see you soon see you