NEAR Protocol @ Devconnect Amsterdam: Building a Multi-Chain, Open Web Future

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   hello lululu test test test test test test test

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   rocket and that will be in the afternoon with ivan david and olega so basically packed agenda lots to cover and hopefully we'll give you more insights into near and what we are about and how you can help and contribute and continue to contribute if you already are so uh from you know starting again like uh top high level view what is near and where we're at um more than ever we are very pushing we're pushing very much for building an open web and a web where actually everybody can be empowered to own their

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   data and their creation and realize more of their human potential right if we can actually flip some of the parting of centralizations on which we are we believe that then people can be empowered to fully focus on their creativity and own their data and their governance and therefore be more creative that's the open web world in terms of protocol near protocol layer one we like things when they are simple so

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   the way we think about the protocol of near is simple scalable and secure simple means two things to us simple means actually simple for end users it means that actually you know i like to use my mom as an example she's quite tech savvy but it means that actually my mom can understand what she can do when she gets a link drop she can understand and she can interact without having to wonder about what is a private key and

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   she has a name and something that is actually usable so simple means simple for users but simple also means simple for developers right we are actually very actively trying to onboard more developers because we believe that if we really want adoption for blockchain we actually need not only superstar ninja developers who can do rust and solidity but also open up the world uh for javascript and and things that are simpler and have you know millions of

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   developers so simple for end users and simple for developers um scalable scalable the principle of actually proof of stake and nitrate sharding and the fact that we are a fully sharded blockchain that can basically infinitely scale and continue to scale is fundamental to the principle of of near as a protocol and last but not least about secure the validator said that continues to grow we are today at over 100 datas and i will continue to grow but continuously secure actually and help secure the the

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   protocol and one one more word with an s that we can add is also sustainable right so when we think actually about developing technologies for the future sustainability is absolutely fundamental and at the core of everything we do i think we were one of the first actually blockchain is now very trendy uh to be you know focusing on climate neutrality and do that but i think we were if not the first one of the first to do that we

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   partner with southpaw to actually continuously assess not only the footprint of the you know the protocol but also the entire footprint of our ecosystem and how can we as an ecosystem continue to be carbon neutral and also learn together to decrease our footprint that enables us to actually attract great projects and more and more we actually see that this is of importance in particular for very large companies

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   who want to go web 2 to web 3 making sure that the partner they choose is carbon neutral and has that at heart so simple secure scalable and sustainable that's us the ecosystem this is very simplified trust me because keeping up with our ecosystem is no small task and because it continues to grow every day and every minute which is absolutely fantastic to see but definitely keeping up is is a challenge but the way we think about it is um quite simply as you can see on this map linear protocol is kind of at

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    the center of everything and around and on that protocol several participants are actually continuously building and developing such as for example pagoda which i think ilia will touch on more aurora you'll hear also about them this afternoon same as octopus in terms of projects that are being built leveraging basically this infrastructure we think of the world in three main compartments of course defy

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    no actually ecosystem can function without having flow of money or functions in some shape or form so d5 is a whole set of projects that are happening on the new ecosystem and has been growing quite significantly over the last five few months the creator economy everything that actually touches today is very nft and gaming and things like that but just things that are enabling creators to interact differently with digital asset

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    that's an other set of projects that are happening and then digital cooperatives which is a fancy word uh coined by i think ilia but it's basically daos uh we love daos i think that was actually extremely interesting for so reshaping how we work and how we engage with projects so i'll touch base a bit more on that but that's basically the world and then on the right hand side you have how we think of actually you know

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    distributions of pockets of of funds and tokens and how players and participants can actually interact with what's happening in our ecosystem we have regional hubs we're continuously growing that because we believe that actually to be very global you need to be very local you need to actually speak the local language this is a good example right if we don't come to amsterdam we don't interact with the local crowd of what's happening here although most of you might not be from mastodon but it

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    actually is giving us that footprint right so being very local to be truly global we have ecosystem funds who are focused on actually enabling and empowering the new ecosystem to grow proximity lab is focused on d5 specifically to actually help that ecosystem grow human guild is focused on on gaming and at the bottom of all that is the part that i lead so it's the near it's the near foundation

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    in terms of numbers um i think here i'll just uh you know cast your eye on maybe the five over 500 projects that have been and are continuously being built uh and the six million uh wallet accounts which are growing tremendously in particular thanks to a partner that we've onboarded recently sweatcorn and i'll come back on that so the near foundation why does the foundation exist and you know in in

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    crypto land foundations kind of are the same format but have different shape and form and so this is our vision and how we actually think of being a foundation at mir and we see a role to help the ecosystem in three main things number one is actually we're here to help raise awareness of near near protocol but also help actually attract more talent our entire space needs more talent not just

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    near but everybody and every builder in the space knows that we need to attract more people so awareness for us means education and that's why you'll hear from shashi and sheriff awareness for us means also having business cases and partners that we can showcase really what's happening to help actually the rest of the world understand what what blockchain and what near could be doing the second pillar is support support to us means actually as a

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    foundation making sure that the infrastructure is in place so um blockchain is lego land right so if the lego and the duplos are in place it works and you can actually collaborate but if the lego are not in place then it's difficult to build a castle and so for example for that thinking of custodians thinking about exchanges but thinking of the fundamental infrastructure that makes actually an ecosystem work is something that the foundation is focused on

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    support also means of course grants we do have a grant program whether it's directly from the foundation or whether it's via ecosystem fern or via the different regions and the last pillar that we actually look at and care about quite a lot of the foundation is actually governance and uh and actually regulatory engagement it's fair to say that we are in a in a world that moves a

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    lot and moves very fast the regulatory landscape is continuously shifting it's not the same across the world it's very difficult to navigate but we think we can actually help bring clarity but also have a voice for our ecosystem to help to help move forward on that front so near university a fantastic program continuously going on and being developed you'll hear more from that from shashi and sheriff

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    although i'm told they have no slides so i have to say i'm a bit worried for them but they'll do great so it will be very engaging no doubt no pressure guys um awareness means also partnership right so there's a couple of partnerships i wanted to raise uh to raise here with you guys um we've announced recently that we are partnering with sale gp cell gps a professional sailing competition

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    with boats that are super impressive go extremely fast it's basically like reproducing grand prix formula one type stuff but on water um and and this is the first we are we've basically announced and we're working on a team being owned by a dao so this is a first in the sports history of actually having a down owning a professional team it's quite unique because to do that you need to have the right infrastructure of a sporting team to actually enable uh

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    the the possibility of doing if you want to do that with for example the nba i'm a huge basketball fan not possible every league every player everything so it's just too complex but anyway this is great we're really looking forward to that because we also think back to awareness we can create a showcase of of what that could be orange dao is super interesting uh nier is the preferred layer one partner of orange

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    dow orange dow is a dow that's been created by y combinator uh alumni uh extremely powerful when you think of creators and the amount of talent that we need we think it's phenomenal to have actually xy combinator founders that are part of a dao and actually want to engage also with near as a protocol unchain uh is an initiative that was spare headed by a few entrepreneurs from ukraine and elia participated in that i think it's absolutely phenomenal to see the power of crypto and the speed at

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    which funds can be raised transparently and then allocated in places where it's very much needed so that's been absolutely fantastic to see that it's been built on astrodaw which is the platform for for daos on near and last but not least so sweat economy we announced that last week i think in the last six days it's already over 700 000 wallets of active engaged users that have been created on near thanks to that it's pretty awesome it's basically you walk you get sweat points and do sweat points at some point will become sweat

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    tokens that are on near and therefore that's creating a whole new way to engage into things through a web 2 company going on to web stream and creating creating a new economy so new economy of movement funding i touch based on that highly encourage you if you want to engage in that you know either to come and meet us and talk to us but funding for us is several things it's of course the funding we do

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    have directly whether us or via our partners ecosystem fund and so on and so forth but it's also actually the reach and the breath that we can give to our project and refer to backers that we know from in our network so that if for example they get a small grant then they can actually get a follow-on from backers in the ecosystem and last but not least so regions as i've mentioned being global today actually means

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    bearing very local and it's simple things such as actually translating locally education material because uh speaking english it's still a very much a privilege in our time and i think we should not underestimate the power of having local languages local community who can really you know engage together build projects and learn and learn together so that's what we do for uh regions

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    i'm done elia you're ready so that was me thank you next up is ilya for the next part of the presentation and then i'll come back we can do q a and we'll be happy to take your questions there hi thank you welcome everyone welcome to people who made it to this early morning it's not that early but given how much partying was happening yesterday let's see if i'll have slides all right something is happening one one day one days one day synchronization

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    of slides will be as smooth as blockchains are now hi awesome so kind of thanks marie can i to give a high level overview and what foundation is doing i'll take on you know the more technical hat and i'll talk about how things are working underneath and what are the pieces of the ecosystem that really are powering powering all those projects that you're working with so kind of looking back to this right

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    kind of three major pieces of like major fractions of ecosystem i would say right you have the kind of go to market you know help and fund and uh grow you have the projects themselves right some of whom are here who are actually building you know end user products and delivering something to the user and then you have kind of all those protocols underneath who are actually making sure that all of the stuff is possible and so zooming in into this

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    infrastructure right there are kind of few pieces that already here and then obviously we're looking for more so near protocol right in the middle kind of started as like hey let's solve some of these problems that other blockchains have or solve some of the problems we've experienced trying to build on other blockchains and at the end kind of end up being like hey this is an open source project that lots of people are working with they're using it in different ways and kind of as any open

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    source project it ends up being that people come up with new ideas they want to customize it they want to do something different with it that what original authors thought is possible and so because this kind of what you see here is kind of an ex like a small explosion but already starting to expand of different ways you can actually take the same code the same approaches and use them in different ways and so before we go into specifics i want to

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    cover actually the protocol itself right so originally the kind of the goal of the year was obviously to build simple secure and scalable system and so we've done a lot of work on simple the if you you know try to build on near if you have used near you've seen kind of you know just changing some of the basic things that other protocols kind of take for granted and copy from each other one to another uh to actually make them more user-friendly right lots of keys different permissions allow you to create like different experiences

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    you have link drops you have you know multiple devices logging in into your wallet with different keys which is by the way more secure and similarly you know webassembly allows you to like take some piece of existing code and just run it right like it still amazes me that you know aurora original aurora was just taking existing evm code and running it as a smart contract right

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    yeah it took a bunch of work to make it kind of all like extremely compatible that aurora is but in general you can take existing pieces of infrastructure and there's really cool one coming kind of in in coming months and start running it and you know as a developer something like this is amazing but kind of beyond that right if we're talking about billions of users if we're talking about bringing this technology to kind of people it needs to work as smoothly and kind of

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    as scalably as you know normal web 2 right you'd never go to like google and google is like well either wait a little bit or pay me more money if you want results right like this is not happening like underneath they have you know at least when i worked there there was like 50 different data centers around the world they were building them like 10 every year kind of to scale up to know ahead of time how much capacities they'll need and kind of

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    beyond that you know kind of splitting and scaling the work underneath and so similar approach similar mindset is used to design near it's like how do we hide the complexity of scalability from the user and at the same time allowed to continuously scale change and innovate and not affect how the users and developers need to build their applications and so this is kind of the whole idea of nightshade and kind of all of this

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    cool words that we've been naming stuff came out is we want to offer developers kind of consistent experience that will scale but we will not implement all the cool stuff that we know we can and also the stuff that we don't know yet because a lot of it is still kind of in research and meanwhile you know half already everything's running right so we launched originally in october 2020 where we had pretty much one shard running it was a lot of the infrastructure was in place already to

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    do sharding but it was not enabled and so over kind of next year right until november 2021 it was actually running with one shard and then one day uh it just changed it just switched to four shards underneath with zero difference to developers zero difference to users right you did not need to like start thinking hey do i have my coins on that shard do i need to like application need to in that chart i cannot call it anymore like it continuously kind of

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    just you know from one lock to another added more capacity and kind of this idea continues right so we call it phase zero what happened uh in november next step will be phase one right so this is where we're gonna add actually a lot more validators to the network uh so-called chunk only block producers i think if you were at sounds taking amaze that core team been doing they've been

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    already explaining how to do it what are the validators you need to run there's some kind of staking contract upgrade that needs to happen as well so all of this is coming it's exciting if you're into running hardware in into kind of supporting the network with that way because it allows a lot more capacity with a lot less stake and then kind of with the phase two what comes in is uh right now there are still some validators in the network that are maintaining kind of all four shards and so with phase two

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    that's kind of is removed requirement is removed all the nodes can be now kind of generic uh equal like equal requirements which the interesting thing about well i would say a lot of pro-stake systems have this but near specifically designed for this is that if the hardware of all the nodes or like kind of the median node hardware is improving right so let's say everybody decides at some point to run it on a supercomputer well the performance of near will actually improve as well naturally so in

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    general the near will run at whatever is the median kind of hardware that the network has and so far we've kind of as the protocol developer has been benchmarking everything it's super like low end hardware to give us this capacity but then inside protocols there's actually automatic kind of expansion that happens that if it sees that the block producers r and chunk producers are really producing blocks and kind of executing stuff really fast and there's tons of capacity more in for time it actually can increase the

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    capacity of the network so all in all like this whole network is designed to kind of increase capacity with hardware and with uh increase of shards and so this is where phase three comes in which is again if you think of netflix google et cetera they don't tell you like hey sorry uh we need to spin up one more roll up to actually serve you or hey there is a need for like you need to set up a service in your own you know yard if you want to

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    watch some movies no it just continuously expands and grows as more users come in and so this is a kind of phase three of near sharding design where the number of shards the kind of assignment of contracts to shards all changes dynamically and again this is done in a way when user as a user you don't need to know about it you don't really care which chart is what on because underneath it all the communication is happening kind of behind the scenes

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    and so as soon as kind of that goes live we're actually kind of able to continuously expand the capacity as more users and more developers come in including if there are contracts like cryptokitties or now aurora that are actually taking a whole shard they will get bumped out in a whole shard and kind of have their own capacity there so on near every single contract can actually get up to a whole

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    shard so a whole chain off like what other chains have capacity for one contract so in a way many kind of if you planning to launch your own chain by the way you can launch a contract and may get your own chain when you actually need it so and again because of their uh hardware requirements as they kind of kind of as people and validators decide to increase hardware uh the capacity of that shard itself will also grow

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    so all in all kind of this whole idea and to be clear like probably you know this is about a year of work uh and folks have been really work harding on phase one and phase two there are probably more stuff coming in there's more research we have you know really cool research on how to do leaderless consensus we have some really cool research on you know new uh like storage mechanisms that are

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    optimizing storage and making a lot of the existing transactions way cheaper there's a lot of zero knowledge stuff that's kind of being researched and may start coming in so underneath the idea is we can continuously change right as the whole community continues to change how backend works we can add all of this new ideas that are coming in you know every year somebody's inventing new ways of how to do blockchains and not affect how the users and developers kind of perceive it that's

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    really important because again in near we stand for innovation right we stand for kind of iterative pragmatic design and implementation we don't try to build you know the best thing and then hope it will survive for like next hundred years and so kind of generally this is the idea in the future some of this will change so expect expect changes but overall uh this so far been pretty stable and kind of gets us toward the goals we outlined now kind of

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    one of the things that uh infrastructure is in this infrastructure realm that been important is who kind of who are you using how you how you're interacting with the blockchain right so beyond just the protocol there's been a lot of need in getting data getting analytics and kind of getting data indexed in specific ways that you're able to build your more sophisticated applications and so

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    uh kind of originally the company that was actually building the protocol right and has most of the core engineers has rebranded to pagoda and with this rebrand the idea was to refocus around providing web3 startup platform right so what does this mean when you're starting to build a new company in web 2.

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    there is a thousand softwares or services that provide you all kinds of pieces of infrastructure right this is everything from heroku to spun up quickly your app to you know intercom to google analytics to mix panel that kind of give you all of the pieces you need you know campaigns is hubspot like tray with automation all of the stuff it's so cool you know you have trello for the um for the task tracker you have you know

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    karta for tracking your uh equity now in web 3 almost none of this works because well we start a company but actually like it's not a company it's a dow and this dao has like people from that place from that place some other companies are part of this dao like now you need to share like at some point our air table had like like four for 50 people in the company we had 200 people 200 seats in air table

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    with like all kinds of like five other companies and like lots of individuals right that's an example of airtable not working for web three right because like your projects and your kind of interactions are not bounded to one company they're not bounded to one domain email they are now spanning across the things like google analytics and mixpanel don't work in brave right it gets cut out

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    because people prefer privacy the things like you know nft can like sorry the email campaigns don't work because you don't have emails you have addresses now and so you have all those things that are different in web3 and so the idea for pagoda is really bring kind of a cohesive stack of tools that you're able to build web 3 startups with right so this starts with data right so it starts with rpcs and indexing and the interesting thing is rpcs are actually the data source you need to do analytics

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    on the usage of your website of your products right and so you can use this and in actually privacy preserving way right you can do like kind of front aggregation on the like few parameters like geo and languages and stuff like this and only store the aggregate accounts and then you can build from there right well you can build triggers right you can say kind of if that uses and then to based on analytics based on what's happening on chain you can start kind of

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    doing push notifications to the users who you may not even have like emails and other communication protocols you can start building dials and tokens which are now kind of way to create communication between different people and even beyond that right nfts now are a better way to do marketing campaigns and so you can start plugging it all in now pagoda is not building all of this right there's astra dao they're doing

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    thousand tokens there's 1b that's going to be doing analytics there's kind of like open source projects for doing world selection and notification but what pagoda is offering is single place where you can have all those in one flow right so developer console so if you go to developer.co and go to console it's a place where as a developer you can start kind of managing your project managing your

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    product and the startup ideally over time with ability to you know add new members manage your release flow uh kind of add you know analytics and triggers to your geoproducts so kind of how do we go beyond just hey this is a hackathon project we just you know put it together to really this is a kind of a startup a company a project which is managed by multiple people we need permissioning system we need you know ways to kind of stage it on testnet we need to ready to upgrade with you know delay and pauses

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    in the contracts we need to do you know analytics and understand when if something is wrong happening maybe other paths a contract all of those things kind of starting to build up this so check it out and you know if you have feedback twitter is the place so there will be more talks on aurora and octopus i'll not go into it but i'll just kind of cover them more conceptual right when we started

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    me personally did not believe in the vm and did not believe in the application specific chains right a lot of design we made in near protocol was kind of to avoid the pitfalls and issues of this approaches but first of all because what i think does not actually matter what developers think does and so what aurora came out of of this idea that although i don't believe evm is the right approach

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    developers do and developers should have the way to kind of to build and use the way they want that's what developer friendly really means and so aurora came out of this idea it was a really kind of quick hack as i mentioned just like hey let's just take an evm piece of code in rust compile it and see what we can do and the answer was well we can actually run some kind of evm contracts and then it took a bunch of time to put it all together but really allowing us to kind of port existing experience

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    as a virtual machine almost on top of the kind of near platform showcases this idea that you can build any experience you want you can actually take out the chains and put them on top of near with their runtime and kind of create the same experience including on the wallet and kind of other sites aurora also ran a really interesting experiment with zero fees which you know we'll see how that evolves

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    but you can build experiences you want who is near and kind of the mobility of the platform underneath is what gives us a gives this kind of opportunity similarly was octopus it was i don't know probably three months of me arguing with lewis that i don't believe in app change and he was like no i don't believe in charting i believe in app chains and so we found somewhere a pass in between where there is

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    a bunch of use cases where you do need a separate app chain you need a separate kind of customized experience on how things are processed but you still want to be connected to the bigger application and so that's what octopus all allows you to do is really easily and quickly to plug in something really custom to kind of a bigger model and allow to kind of have all this communication

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    out of the box and do it like you know super scalably super cheaply all the usual stuff and so beyond that you know rainbow is kind of being our like how do we actually link up the ecosystems because on one side you know we can say hey we built the best tech you know they'll come usually doesn't happen and so how do we actually create this linkage with existing ecosystems with existing users that is

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    secure right again simple secure scalable how do we make it simple secure and in this case scalable as well and so to do that kind of the only way that is truly secure is a trustless bridge which does not rely on any intermediary and so again designing that it was complicated we started probably earlier than anyone in bridges and we launched like somewhere after a lot of folks but it allowed us to kind of build this like fully trustless bridge that does not have kind of points

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    of attack that some other bridges have been hacked with uh it does not have a way to kind of for someone to stop it like you as a user you can always actually you know operate it even yourself because all of those things is permissionless and at the end it allows to build kind of new experiences on top it's like very customizable and very kind of it's like a lego three lego bricks that you can put in different ways

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    so i mentioned kind of samso's interoperability side but then beyond interpretability there's a whole web 2 world right and which is way bigger than that 3 right now and this web 2 world is all looking at this and says they are nuts these guys are putting all the data on public constantly and saying they are you know privacy preserving we're running a bank we're running a you know an enterprise company we have gdpr

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    we have you know like privacy requirements for our users we try to preserve pii they are crazy and they're true right blockchains are not a privacy preserving technology they are transparency engine they designed consensus in general is the idea that everybody agrees on everything because everybody observed everything and so to go beyond that you need more technology zero knowledge or more ways to do

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    kind of consensus without revealing data and so this is where calimerian comes in calimera was this idea that well yes there's a lot of use cases when data does not need to travel to the public blockchain you can still prove to others some facts about this data you can run applications you can communicate with others you don't need to tell exactly what's happening underneath and so this is the idea of so-called private chart private chart is

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    kind of running in parallel to near and the you know each company can run its own private chart meaning behind its firewall and they are on that private chart can run all the same applications including aurora and kind of have the whole scope there and they can communicate with the public chain and with other private charts there's other applica kind of applications in other companies and so there's different security parameters of this whole setup right it's not you know everybody's

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    validating everything now but it actually offers you enough kind of tool set and instrumentation to prove things like let's say university running it that my gpa is above 3.9 right without revealing exactly how what the marks i got for every single subject it may allow me to prove that i never had for example criminal offense or cancer if this data is recorded and so sounds as like proofs are kind of authority-based right this is based on

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    this database and so it's fine that you know harvard running the private chart will kind of authorize as proofs but at the same time if some individual in hardware decides to like manipulate with this data they're not able to and so similarly like this is kind of you know quote unquote sounds like enterprise but actually if you're in a dow you probably have a lot of stuff that you want to discuss and

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    vote on without revealing in public if you're a hedge fund you can run a dark pool using this technology as well right you can actually do trading on a dark pool on this without revealing and all the other folks who are running their private charts can communicate with it and you just settle on at the end so these use cases are not just for you know what we call enterprise it's

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    actually like across the board from d5 to nfts like folks can issue nfts on private charts and then allow them to travel to the public chain so all in all super exciting calimero is just starting uh some exciting team there uh some of our folks who actually build original infrastructure for near uh are starting it and so i'll finish with a little bit more um kind of call for action and uh

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    leave you some ideas about security so again simple secure scalable i talked about scalable you know i hope you already been exposed to the simplicity of near and so let's dive into secure so when we originally kind of established that we're like well you know we're designing with security in mind it's blockchain you know we have cryptography we've you know it's audited it's uh you know the most amazing

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    technology ever obviously and so everybody else everything else on top is guaranteed by cryptography right you should be good every and then as we started to roll it out we realized that well not everybody is like feeling comfortable storing the seed phrases like this whole thing was like i don't know fishing like right now i just i did this like the other day and search for near wallet there's like three different google ads for fishy websites which i hope they will bring down soon

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    so there's like a ton of kind of constant activity that on one side is attacking users on the other side users themselves are not always able to to kind of uh protect themselves right they're not always able to judge what is the right thing here and so at the same time you know who haven't seen like who has who reads rect here all right you should all redirect so if you don't know what rectus is pretty much a stream of all the hacks that are happening in crypto and it's

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    pretty morbid in a way because like there's a lot of stuff getting hacked all the time uh i mean obviously probably a lot of us heard about like 600 million and 200 million dollar hack but there's like you know 10 million dollar hack also centralized exchanges actually don't tell when they're getting hacked because they're getting hacked all the time so all in all like there's a lot of stuff going on and as a user again you

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    don't actually have that much ability to kind of understand right like hey these guys have audit what does that actually mean is it started like for this contract somebody did analysis about 30 of audits are completely outdated another 30 percent are somewhat outdated meaning like audit was done on a contract that's completely different that's deployed hacking team been doing a lot of this

84. 2:04:27

    check them out and so kind of how do we go beyond kind of i have the seat phrase and it's you know this is this is not just the key to all the fortune it's like the key right it's the only thing that's like between between the you know all of the nfts and that i have and and the an attacker and in web 2 right there is like i wouldn't say it's completely solved but there is a lot of methods that have been used right uh if somebody's like if your password

85. 2:04:56

    got leaked if all these things happen there's ways to kind of you know kick in and recovery there's an active threat prevention model that actually analyzes the activity and tries to struggle it there's 2fa there's you know kind of like recoveries to other means and stuff like this and so how do we bring a lot of these things into crypto with the web3 mindset with permissionless mindset and allow people to kind of secure

86. 2:05:21

    themselves right and so near started with this idea of progressive security right this is where our account model was very handy because you can actually you know set up an account with maybe key that's not very securely stored and then you can change it you can always add a new key delete the old key and you know new keys for for example from your hardware device and you're good but even beyond that right

87. 2:05:45

    we added 2fa so the ability to for somebody else to confirm your transactions they are not able to initiate them so they're not able to kind of create like send you money they can only say that if you send me money you're good right and so kind of going like more into this model like calling it active custody right so it's not a full custody on the other side by the by whatever the party like but they are actively monitoring the transactions you're making the activity you're making

88. 2:06:17

    and they're co-signing or like authorizing this activity to happen right because for example if some if the transaction comes in that moves all your assets out probably something is wrong right probably should throttle this probably it's fine if you know it takes like a day or two to resolve that right versus you know if you're just sending a bunch of money to a farm should be fine except if that farm is actually known malicious for malicious contract that you should not be sending money to and so this is where the

89. 2:06:48

    registry of the contract audits right ability to have a hash of a code hash of a executable and hash of a contra audit all in one place being able to kind of easily fetchable when you're doing the transaction show you exact information on what you're transacting with if this contract has been audited has this contract been known to be malicious right having a registry of bug bounties and kind of

90. 2:07:13

    security notices like all of this will pretty much allow like surfaced in a wall directly when you're making transactions will allow to actually stop i mean i'm not saying everything obviously not but stop a lot of the current kind of malicious activity that's happening and protect the user and so like and having this model would allow to start detecting this vulnerabilities ahead of time because now there is actual market to do this and actually

91. 2:07:39

    kind of by surfacing this you allow to stop things that are happening without even revealing sometimes exact vulnerability before it's fixed right so you have an ability to kind of create this more active model where we're securing the users and we kind of protecting the users instead of saying like well it's your problem so this is kind of a ask for everyone that you know if you're working on apps on

92. 2:08:04

    uh wallets or you know if you a user to voice it to your wallet to kind of start adopting this model right and so neo already has some of these pieces kind of in the ecosystem but now we need to put it all together and really offers this kind of as a cohesive experience in all the wallets kind of throughout all the applications so that's pretty much it and we can do some q a are we doing stand-up comedy no i mean

93. 2:08:58

    hello thank you uh very much for the presentations um near's been super successful in fundraising um today i think it's one of the best um that i've seen um what what's the plan generally for a lot of the like capital that you've raised what areas of focus um is that going to drive or develop yeah thanks so um the three pillars i mentioned right so awareness support and governance and external regulatory engagement but on the on the awareness front actually continuously powering our education

94. 2:09:32

    program making sure that we can actually engage and have partnership whether it's at state level whether it's actually with institutions or whether it's actually with private companies that there's a whole stream on that awareness also means uh the partnership that you sow for example with cell gp or orange dao some of those are commercial agreements um and awareness lastly also means for example you know events like that and and more broadly and more

95. 2:09:58

    generally we're finding the balance between how much brand awareness do you do how much go-to-market you do but there is a bucket of things that's definitely happening there um it's not the largest by far the second pillar is actually when i mentioned how do we actually support our products so within that again to sub stream the infrastructure i'm sure most of you know but if you want to actually engage in an agreement for infrastructure

96. 2:10:22

    partnership usually those are also commercial agreements that sometimes actually require tokens but sometimes also require fiats because at the end of the day liquidity for eating sandwiches and paying employees is remains the the last part and actually that liquidity part is also something we see translated in in some of our grants so when we uh when we give grants to to projects uh of

97. 2:10:46

    course it's aligning incentive to have tokens and to have you know things that are locked and and that are on the very long term but we're also very conscious that most often actually for in particular developers and young projects it's unplugging them from where they are and therefore making sure that they can have that level of sustainability again you know i mean i'm characterizing but buying sandwiches and homes and all that

98. 2:11:10

    right so it's very much along those along those plans um we're extremely cautious in how we deploy capital i think what you can hear from us is also uh we are at the same time very conscious that we're in an industry that moves very very fast but we're thinking very very long term right so in all our developments and everything the key metric for us is weekly active engaged users and that's what we're trying to drive when we deploy the capital more broadly speaking do you

99. 2:11:33

    want to add anything yeah i think to add is kind of this idea of regional expansion right it requires a kind of going in and setting up a pretty big operation right like in a way we're kind of creating mini foundations in every region uh and obviously like it's about finding leaders it's about finding kind of team that will be doing it but also it's about establishing a fund there

100. 2:11:57

     establishing grand program kind of uh you know helping out people to start building things and obviously kind of start awareness et cetera and so as we're thinking like what is the truly global presence would mean like that's actually a lot of these regional hubs and so i think on the map there was like about 20 ish and so this is kind of even the kind of medium term plan to roll that out and so that's that's also takes a lot of resources thank you

101. 2:12:33

     um so i had a question uh regarding some of the uh complexities of the intercharge communication um so essentially i'm coming from like the ethereum kind of paradigm we're very used to atomicity and also very cognizant of muv and it kind of seems like uh if you have this like callback architecture it seems very easy for people to kind of block transactions or block value transfer in a way that can be somewhat destructive

102. 2:12:59

     make it difficult for people to interact cross charts i was kind of wondering like in order to combat that uh are you more arguing for people to develop do paradigm for programming where that kind of attack is impossible or you're kind of looking at like zero knowledge architecture to make sure that what people are trying to do across chard can't be revealed at intercepted kind of your thoughts on that yeah so kind of from the beginning we

103. 2:13:24

     have argued for a different model of building applications and so this is kind of i think the simplistic version of this has been you know you wrote single threaded applications and when the multi-core came you kind of needed to build them differently right if you're building on a lower level and so that's been kind of similar approach here if you try to use the same model where you like send you know send the call

104. 2:13:49

     another contract and then wait for it to come to do something that's not the right way to do it right you kind of need to build this like look free applications to do this to to do this right and so i think like what we've seen in reality is that there are kind of two paradigms emerged one paradigm is kind of what aurora is using and ref finance is using where you actually move all the assets into one contract and then inside one contract you're you know free to do

105. 2:14:18

     stuff and you can expand that contract with more functionality either dynamically like aurora or statically through upgrades and then the other the other paradigm is where you actually build the complexity of the kind of cross-contract calls but then you're doing that very mindfully and understand exactly the outcomes of this and so i think we'll see this continue expanding and as par part of the i think

106. 2:14:42

     uh probably anton will mention on like kind of how we're beefing up performance of single charts so you can actually do more with this first paradigm kind of i call it a single threaded paradigm while you know for people who are actually trying to get the most out of near they can go this multi-threaded paradigm and actually build a proper experience without locks how many people understood what i just said

107. 2:15:18

     yeah hi um i'm not a developer so excuse me if my question sounds dumb but as far as i understand that most governments are cautious about crypto because having little uh control over it so in terms of near and private charts and semi-custodial approaches and and semi-centralized approach can near be used to issue uh central bank uh cryptocurrencies cbdc's or and do you have plans working with with the governments in that area yes to all three

108. 2:15:52

     yeah so one of the use cases for calimera is cbtc central uh bank digital currency and we actually had a pilot with a country that's currently at war so that got paused but there are few few other pilots that are kind of in progress in conversation but yeah it's definitely one of the use cases where you can use all the same tech and at the same time you're actually able to communicate with the public chain from it so you are able to bring this digital currency to public chain start using d5

109. 2:16:24

     while they maintain all of the kind of accountability and like analytics and all the kind of things they need to to actually you know be regulated as as they require nikolai my question is kind of related to the governments and it involves the mass adoption uh so a lot of like there are web to companies that want to start looking for web3 solutions and for blockchains do you have a department or what kind of steps do you do to find those companies that want to

110. 2:17:07

     start the journey with nir and are you even interested in onboarding like big web 2 institutions into near right now i think it's an amazing question actually it's a very live debate at the foundation so right now um most of the web 2 companies that approach it it's been it's been actually organic and it's been coming to us and i think what i found very interesting in that is that um for

111. 2:17:30

     example to to mention cell gp they literally chased us right and they were like we want to work with you because we've tested the technology because actually from a purpose perspective and from a philosophy perspective you guys are very aligned and so on and so forth so so far we've been in a position where we are very much chased so before before being at near um i was i worked in in a bank and i was leading

112. 2:17:52

     a neo bank and so i think it's fair today i've been a bit burned of working in very large organizations and trying to innovate in very large organizations what that means is um there is power in doing that because there is millions of users currently that are on very large web 2 platform but if you look at you know the the near foundation and the new ecosystem we're talking very small teams here right and we are talking about actually very small teams who are very

113. 2:18:19

     agile who work extremely fast and every time you we have to interact with large uh large organizations it's about finding who are the right stakeholders how to engage it's it's several several conversations right so the point being we definitely see like an appeal for it um i think there is a role for evangelists and it's also linked to education actually right so one thing we're looking at and thinking about i

114. 2:18:44

     didn't talk to really about that yet so thanks for asking but one thing i'm thinking about is actually having roles of evangelists who are actually going and actively educating pitching this is board level conversation one thing i'm hearing a lot right now is um you know ceos of web 2 companies saying hey my board wants me to look at that and have a webster strategy which is fantastic and i'm happy to have an intro chat right but the intro chat starts from uh here is

115. 2:19:09

     the bitcoin history and then ethereum and then and and so it will take time right so point being there is a place it will take time for us as foundation and as ecosystem we need to choose actually which bets we take and that's why you know the bets without light outline here are the bets for now and i think we're continuously looking at uh looking at doing doing that right but there is a

116. 2:19:32

     the tide is the tide is moving like i think also if you see even six months ago um you know i came back to crypto and i think people were thinking oh you know why are you going back and now the amount of people i see coming in like even the talent shift is starting to happen so like a lot of that moment is in motion but yeah we'll talk evangelism though thanks hi i was just wondering to maybe build upon that last question and ask um what your thoughts are in when it comes to

117. 2:20:11

     web3 interoperability um especially when it comes to utility and um if i was wondering if you could perhaps build upon your thoughts in regards to that especially when it comes to for example the rainbow bridge and other perhaps later ones you'd be looking to expand on so the question is kind of just to expand more interoperability so high level i think there are a lot of uncertainty about the kind of what does multichain future will look like right but it's kind of if we learn anything from history there will be

118. 2:20:46

     not one probably at least i i think three to five like up to 10 chains that have taken on some types of kind of market and are able to operate right and so within that you kind of need to connect those chains you need to offer users a simple way to interact with them and you need to offer a kind of a smooth way for applications to communicate and so kind of to do that you have to have some message communication buses and you have

119. 2:21:19

     to have some kind of end user kind of in-application experiences that are allowing to do this now the thing i just mentioned is that yesterday the bridge panel we need to realize that right now all most used bridges are actually centralized exchanges right if you want to bridge some assets you actually most likely bridging it through by sending it to centralize exchange and then moving it back into another chain and so that's not really i believe the right way to do it and so kind of going

120. 2:21:49

     beyond that like rainbow bridge is one way to do it there's you know things like connects there's things which is a kind of atomic swaps um there are a few newer ways that are kind of instead of bridging liquidity are kind of shuffling it to allow to not have like not kind of lock unlock mechanism um which allows to kind of avoid some of the potential kind of hack issues that that we've seen and so like i think the technology will

121. 2:22:19

     continue innovating there will be some zero knowledge stuff that you know will leverage as well but at the end like for the user like none of that really matters what matters is that you can go to an app and you can connect with your other change wallet and deposit some funds and it will work right and or like you know put some put your nft that you have on ethereum to play in the game and near and so this is really where we're aiming kind of as i would say

122. 2:22:43

     as a space in general to get to that um again still a bunch of research a bunch of development it's not that easy all the chains are very different and so we'll kind of you know iterate on how to build chances but kind of the experience at the end will be you know you have your like wallets that are able to connect to multiple chains or you have multiple walls to connect it and then you'll just

123. 2:23:06

     interact with apps and then you know it's kind of more smoothly communicated between them and then some chains will be broken sorry hi um in terms of defy and near versus other blockchains if we is there anything in the ecosystem or technology stack right now or in the plan to be built that will help defy startups to be more competitive versus other blockchains so the question is other things that are

124. 2:23:42

     being built in the ecosystem that will def make dfi more competitive than in other chains in terms of the technology of neo itself or the ecosystem of neo is a blockchain got it got it yeah so kind of the benefit of near right the simplicity as well as simplicity for people to build really interesting experiences is probably the piece to look at right so again i'll kind of highlight aurora because aurora ran without fees for a period of time and like no other

125. 2:24:19

     apps in d5 have offered that right and so you if you want to build a defy app on near you can actually offer that right now right there's ways to do it like you can actually build economics and you know with a proper infrastructure you can actually offer this to your users to offer zero fees like that's a pretty unique capability rainbow bridge is actually very unique in a way that is able to push data into other contracts and this is actually true about near specific

126. 2:24:48

     implementation because we have callbacks you're able instead of like you know this whole approve swap thing that you use on ethereum you can actually push funds and push communication into apps and so you can actually implement this multi-chain interface where you deposit funds from other chains and they directly appear in your application like you don't need to do like move then go to app then approve then put like instead of having this multi-step process you can just have

127. 2:25:18

     like one in integrated in your app and so combining all this and you know performance and cheap fees you can actually build some of the really cool applications which are some of them are being built i'm not going to reveal them but um which offer kind of all this combined right like zero fees directly deposit from other chains uh you know and and like some of the other cool stuff and kind of at a high performance and offer that kind of is a replacement for some more traditional finance tools

128. 2:25:50

     as well oh hi so as an active defy user i'm just curious because i heard near is going to soon have its stable coin like usn so i wonder how is that going to impact the ecosystem and how is the mechanism compared to luna and ust so i've seen it on twitter yesterday and so i think we'll all follow on twitter how's that going um i would just say that like high level the like when we were designing economics veneer it was pretty clear

129. 2:26:32

     that there needs to be a stable client as a unit of exchange and unit of account because that actually kind of again if we're talking about simplicity that's way simpler if your fees are in you know stable unit of account not in constantly changing similarly like your storage fees all of the economics kind of based on more stability is way simpler and so kind of following that pattern that's

130. 2:26:57

     important now there are projects in ecosystem building and experimenting with this and i'm excited to see how they evolve so i'm i'm with you to see how that how's it gonna go everyone uh thank you for the great presentation i think you've done incredible work with the new ecosystem you know just overall growth i remember last time i was at near con and right now it's been like incredible progress and i wonder so right now there's a whole like regenerative

131. 2:27:30

     finance you know like revolution happening behind the scenes people becoming you know they're transferring more from djs to regions and they wonder what are your thoughts and the overview because i know there's a lot of projects and near that building because of sustainability aspect right that's important for you i'd love to learn more like your thoughts on that site you mean on sustainability in general

132. 2:27:53

     um so high level right i mean we're living in like one planet so we kind of need to take care of it and so if we start to think long term there needs to be ways to address it i think like you know being carbon neutral is the first step but kind of offering a more cohesive strategy there i'm actually would be interested in working with someone if somebody wants to build a more cohesive strategy like how to use talking economics like one idea actually came from a friend of mine it's like well what if we use some currency let's

133. 2:28:26

     say a stable coin that uh automatically actually deducts when you transact with other entities uh their carbon offset right so pretty much which means they are motivated to receive more money on their side to be carbon neutral and at the same time it does offsets right so like when you're booking a ticket it automatically will you know you don't need to check mark it you pay the amount

134. 2:28:50

     and then it will offset that when um when they receive so things like that like we can actually build a lot of this tooling directly into the kind of our transaction processing our you know our wallets our like paying with cards all of this infrastructure and then beyond that right we're talking about natural resources and other stuff forests like this open forest protocol like what are all those pieces and how they'll fit together again super important i think we need we

135. 2:29:16

     need a lot more investment there so i think two additional thoughts on that um one is when you look at people who want to get into the space i think the narrative is shifting but it's still very much you know it's still very much about price and about the the damage that actually technologies like for example uh proof of proof of work are doing to the environment right and and that we can we feel it because when we want to attract new talent to the ecosystem it is still the narrative right and whether

136. 2:29:46

     actually it's attracting developers or people who want to work on the project that's still that so i think as an industry actually and especially for projects who think the way we think i think it's also our role to change that narrative and to show that there is a different way to do the technology and there is actually a different approach for that that's possible um i think that's going to unlock actually attracting talent right and so that's that's definitely a very important piece

137. 2:30:11

     it's difficult because you need first to go again to like what is proof of work and then what's the difference with proof of stake and how can you do it and so on and so forth but we take a very big part in in that narrative so that's the piece number one um number two is what elia mentioned right so the the attributes we have actually are great because they attract actually projects were specifically looking for which chain to build on that actually fits that fits that alignment and that

138. 2:30:36

     purpose and so i think that's really good one thing that we are looking for and again very open to ideas here but one thing we're looking for if you remember on the map we showed like different ecosystem funds and funds that are focused on certain things uh one thing where we're very actively looking at is okay what if we do something that's actually focused on sustainability and maybe just not sustainability better esg right we take a lot of pride in when we allocate uh grants and funding

139. 2:31:00

     looking also at you know the diversity of the team the diversity of background the diversity of local footprint um because more broadly it's about thinking long term i think it's important that the way we build this uh is you know sustainable and it's inclusive from the start so that it's embedded in the technology uh over time right but the narrative i find is it's a you know every still most journalist

140. 2:31:22

     right so it's still like the the first impression is not it's not good so lots of work even regulators hi uh i'm martin um i'm a developer background um and i have a bit of a date i don't know how to say this in english but like um so yesterday i saw this thing from hideo van rossum i'm pretty sure you saw it as well it's an old colleague of yours from google um about web3 just to give some context for who people don't know about it like webtree should what die in a flaming ball of fire whatever he said

141. 2:32:15

     i'm a bit of a crypto believer so for me i put this kind of stuff on the side but i kind of wonder how you navigate um the crypto space when uh some of the you know tech giants or just there's so much skepticism against crypto i i don't want to say like we're in this church of crypto here because it doesn't feel that way at all but how do you feel about it so so when we went into crypto so i'm

142. 2:32:49

     from google and obviously i meet with my ex google colleagues and when i told them like hey we're doing crypto um one person asked me are you insane um the other person was like uh isn't it all scam uh both of them have invested in crypto now one of them was the person who was talking about the sustainability coin like actually embedding sustainability into the coin itself so i would say it takes time people who

143. 2:33:20

     are not actually exposed to it directly to be clear in 17 i thought it's all scam as well so i was on that side of a boat as well and proof of work is you know destroying destroying the planet plus completely the opposite of how the kind of humanity works like where you know you're doing you're using less energy to do more not like to do the same more energy which is what bitcoin is um but again like until you actually try to understand what the problems are

144. 2:33:51

     solved right and what is the actual impact on you know people on society on sustainability on all those things with the project so they're exactly there and this is why we actually back in kind of end of 19 started open web collective because we were like hey literally i don't have a good example to tell people about what's a successful web 3 startup been back then like all back at that point everything was kind of like not really working and you know and saying like well ethereum a

145. 2:34:23

     successful startup was not really like example that people would take right and so we started opening a collective because like well let's actually like accelerate projects even if we didn't have near launched yet so it's like well we'll we're going to launch it on whatever networks but let's actually get some successful examples which you know we can show to our friends to invite more people to join the space and so i think at this point we do have examples uh we do have

146. 2:34:49

     things that are really exciting i think like sweatcoin type of thing for example where you have a transition of like web 2 existing thing into f3 like again i mean i'm from ukraine like a ton of people uh before were were like actually getting into it because they saw like as opportunity and this ability to kind of capitalize on the like a lot of developers they have to really start pushing things that are truly global right because building pro like actually web 2 products out of ukraine was really hard the market the

147. 2:35:21

     local market is not there but web 3 is actually global first and and it doesn't really matter who you build who you are and so like things like that right like one after another people kind of come into this and so for me like i mean this is the same um like a bunch of currently like people who are you know on youtube going to bankless et cetera like if you look at two years ago

148. 2:35:46

     uh they were talking about you know between bitcoin and banana they'll choose banana right like all of this have happened like there's people pretty much every single person who right now is in crypto is press probably at some point said kryptos is a scam so i would give guido maybe like one or two years and we'll see him you know hacking on web three and and maybe to to add on that so i had

149. 2:36:12

     some of the similar reactions i remember i was um end of 2015 when uh i got a call to work for circle and at the time i thought uh bitcoin was for criminals so i had the same reaction i think when i left uh when i left expedia people was thought i was completely mad and out of uh you know out of my mind but i think it's evangelism it's education and it's what elia mentioned it's real use cases right so i think that's why these use cases are extremely important to show um

150. 2:36:39

     and and again sometime one of my worries that we are in our little bubble and we are all convinced and the minute you step out of that bubble the amount of you know uh opacity that it feels like like how many times do you hear people telling you i don't really understand and there's always like like you know how do i get in right and i think as an industry we must simplify we must make things actually understandable and

151. 2:37:02

     simplifying is very difficult right but i think actually not simplifying is hiding behind something saying like you know using old jargon and kind of like do your own homework i don't buy that stuff i think if we actually want really people to embrace it needs to be real use cases at the end of the day users will not care what technology it is on it needs to do something for them that's actually rewarding and solving a problem and number two we

152. 2:37:27

     really need to break down those barriers and make it simple understandable so that it's accessible and so that people can feel they can actually participate but it's one drop at a time yeah hello okay so then um aside from simplifying um the use case for the end user could you maybe expand upon you know we have um as elijah said there the future will most likely be a couple of change for chains like four to five

153. 2:38:07

     and um but we currently have layer ones that are sustainable we have other layer ones that are scalable we have their ones that are chips um could i just ask to bring the focus to near like what would you say aside from the simplification really sets near apart from other competitors well i i can start i'm sure yeah has lots of ideas on that but actually i think at this stage a lot is also going to be into strategy and execution right and and how what do we do as an ecosystem right and

154. 2:38:40

     and how do we drive things and what do we believe in and what do we focus on uh and we should make no mistake it's a race right it's a race yes it's a very uh it's a very agreeable race with like bridges and interoperability and so on and so forth and there is space for everybody to grow because the pies is very big but nevertheless it's a race and the reality is like the bets we make short-term thinking long-term and that whole strategic element i think are are

155. 2:39:04

     very important so that's the part i would add i'm sure you have a ton of ideas well so i think it starts with the goal right like i honestly don't know what is the goal for ethereum even though i talk with the folks there a lot for us you know we have kind of outlined you know if we're talking about kind of the mission that is to give people control over data over their assets of the power of governance if you're talking about how measuring is this is about you know billion active engaged

156. 2:39:35

     users that are interacting with business applications and platforms if we're talking about how we're doing this well we're doing it as a simple and secure and scalable and sustainable way right and so we have a very clear kind of message strategy metrics everybody can hook in we have regional hubs we have you know eco funds we have guilds like human guild and kind of proximity product labs there's

157. 2:39:59

     space for everyone who wants to start something to come in and prove their worst and and kind of develop developing this and at the end it's kind of for me at least about like achieving those goals and changing the world in that way especially like again i mean past months has been an interesting uh kind of exposure to what have what can happen if we don't achieve that because

158. 2:40:24

     people don't have power of governance in and are not able to affect things and like how do we actually kind of go against that and how do we use those tools because they are useful we already proven that uh which goes back into like kind of some of the people who are skeptics like i just want to mention i'm in draft here um kind of started and like with the chain fund it's been a huge help but also crypto in general has

159. 2:40:47

     been huge help to ukraine it was able to start delivering help like same day you know post kind of across to order things to deliver stuff like yeah i mean not everything is using crypto like it's it's a tool it's not you know panacea but it is showcasing that this is useful instruments that we can use kind of as we build more tooling we can use more to make decisions and kind of build better logistics systems which i

160. 2:41:12

     really hope we can do soon but like in general right you have this like kind of global vision that i would say web 3 kind of have like roughly outlined but we have a very clear like what are we trying to achieve how we're trying to achieve it the structure we have you know a place for everyone who wants to start something to come in and do it and so that's really like for me that's an important part and then you know we

161. 2:41:37

     build bridges we work with others we you know we have whiteboard series to kind of collaborate on research we actually talked with a lot of researchers and kind of folks with you know have found vulnerabilities and other protocols and have helped them fix them so kind of from this perspective like we always try to kind of lift this space and at the same time you know really deliver on the value that we're setting out

162. 2:42:22

     thank you hello yeah thanks uh first of all thanks for organizing things uh very appreciated and i guess i'm one of the last questions so it's more of less of open than the question and i'll accept a very short answer uh but when i start explaining to non-crypto people about web3 i usually use the traffic of dao nfts and d5 and kind of the corner foundations of what is about to come and since industries love buzzwords is there anything you think deserves a buzzword or is upcoming

163. 2:43:03

     like for example i i do like the what kilometers building like the private shark component i think that might evolve into a new buzzword but essentially what do you think is the kind of the next big thing no pressure thanks not financial advice right what is the next i mean honestly we should have less buzzwords this is why i was like instead of dao's i prefer to use digital cooperative because it actually is like cooperative is something that actually been existing

164. 2:43:34

     for hundreds of years and you know we're just making it digital it's actually very much similar structure in bylaws you can write whatever kind of the system you want some dows have used cooperatives as a as actually a legal wrapper for them and so overall kind of going back to education less buzzwords less kind of jargon which i'm by the way very guilty of simplifying how kind of how we describe this is definitely an important piece i think it's a question of like what's the next big thing i mean for sure i think

165. 2:44:07

     the like actually integrating more with web 2 applications is that and uh one of actually our partners have wrote like a 40 page their journey from not knowing nothing about web 3 to building a web 3 like to transferring their web to application to web 3. it's 40 pages everything from like blocks accounts transactions like tokens nfts like just covering every single thing that they've had questions about they documented that thing the fact that it takes 40 pages for them to

166. 2:44:38

     understand that is kind of a problem and so this is really what we need to work on i mean it's good they wrote this article and it's going to come out soon but like overall this type of like how do we simplify this onboarding such that they don't need to understand all this basic stuff to build an application and as soon as we have that as soon as we unlock it i think a lot of this kind of existing apps that you know can have already market economy

167. 2:45:05

     but are not unlocked yet will come yeah i'll make it similar lines but like less buzzwords more simplifications but um one trend maybe that i'm hopeful for and that i see a lot of traction in and looking for real use cases is back to sustainability and actually when we think of supply chains and when we think of actually traceability and actually quantifying what the impact of things are i think there's a big role to play and so i'm actually really hopeful and looking for more projects

168. 2:45:38

     within that area which i think we're starting to see phenomenal entrepreneurs thinking about that and building uh real use cases so yeah i'll leave you on the trying to save the planet with with you know good intention but also is like technology that is actually not harming what we what we're doing so thank you so much for your questions i think it's coffee time don't go too far away then there's shashi and sheriff with no slides with no slides for an

169. 2:46:02

     education session thank you

170. 3:47:27

     welcome back everybody hope you enjoyed the lunch heading for the second part of today i'm giving the floor to shashi and sharif for um near nh education plans enjoy hey can you hear me nice welcome welcome to folks watching the stream uh welcome to folks sitting here hopefully lunch was good we've got about 10 minutes before you start to pass out on us so let's see if we can keep it interesting for you

171. 3:48:04

     we are uh the guys without the slides as you've heard earlier although we did put this up here in case you're not sure what we do we spend time on education uh at near university and uh huge fans of nir obviously and uh and so we wanted to get a sense first of all who is in the room today so for those of you participating at home please feel free to answer these questions we're just not going to hear

172. 3:48:28

     your answers but for everybody here in the room if you could join us in raising your hand high and give us a chance to count because we can't really see with these lights we want to get a sense of the breakup in the audience how many entrepreneurs we have versus developers and of course if you're not if you don't fit yourself into one of those two then feel free to just not raise your hand you won't be counted and what we're going to be doing is actually spending the time over the next hour

173. 3:49:02

     speaking to you based on who's in the audience so i think we can start with that basic question please raise your hand high and hold it for i don't know 10 20 seconds while we count if you identify yourself as an entrepreneur like this not like some hearts okay great about 25 people raising their hands as entrepreneurs thank you so much how about developers raise your hand if you identify as a developer a 20. it's almost an even split let's just split the time 50 50.

174. 3:49:53

     okay nice so there you go uh who should we start with i think uh developers developers first okay some developers are most anxious folks that i've met developers are most anxious folks that i've met so let's start with them so that the anxiety is taken care of okay so uh for all of you anxious developers out there um i i think uh the the conversation that i would like to have with you for the next i don't know 20 30 minutes something like that

175. 3:50:24

     and i do hope that you engage with us uh you know in asking questions answering questions and so on is what does it mean uh actually to learn software development what does that mean what does that journey mean for you uh and what are some of the challenge that you have along the way that's what i'd like us to talk about for a little bit here if you don't mind so let me just get a sense of the developers in the room how many people here have more than 10 years software development experience can you raise your hand more than 10

176. 3:50:56

     years that's six or seven people how about uh people with less than two years software development experience one or two okay so most of the folks here have been building software for quite a while um does anybody want to give junior developers maybe watching at home couple of folks here in the room give them a tweet of advice how do you become a great developer what do you do

177. 3:51:27

     as a developer as a senior developer what do you think about how do you think about what you're doing any ideas anybody want to give us a tweet size piece of advice for senior developers to junior developers yeah one over here thank you yeah so i actually uh started development not in college but after college so i kind of learned how to program on my own uh like who i am or my name or oh yeah my name is arun uh yeah so i kind of started programming after college had to learn myself and i

178. 3:52:00

     would say that the best thing to learn is to find something you're really interested in building and then build that so my first project was actually a browser-based physics simulation of gravitational interaction is hard body collisions and that was something that was pretty fun to build so i played something like that that wasn't tweet size but yeah yeah no for sure so so it's it sounds like really to

179. 3:52:24

     become a senior developer or to succeed in your journey at learning how to build software follow your passion you're saying follow something that you're excited about and pursue that it's like doing something not for passion like can only get so far with it but you can kind of burn out if you actually like doing it you'll come back to it naturally yeah so so let's tug on that thread a little bit let me see what you all think

180. 3:52:48

     about this one of the uh challenges that we have when we're learning uh is that most of our experience learning has actually come from a kind of industrial framing of education where you have to sit down and move through let's say a course from beginning to end you know to learn something or open a book on chapter one and read until the last chapter almost punishing yourself with that lesson with that content it's it's kind of a chore homework as opposed to home play

181. 3:53:28

     and what's interesting to me about what you said this first piece of advice that we have from senior developers in the room pick something that you're excited about what if we could remind junior developers maybe even ourselves as senior developers let's say to start with the thing that's most interesting so to take a specific example um have you ever read a book a technical book let's say by starting

182. 3:53:59

     with the most interesting chapter first can i get a show of hands of people that do that yes one two three about 10 or 15 people do that and and what do you do with the the kind of the fomo the sense that you're not following in the right order how do you handle that don't you get a little bit anxious maybe you missed some piece of information in chapter one if you're skipping to chapter two or three don't you get a sense of anxiety that

183. 3:54:29

     you're missing out on that and i wonder some people are shaking their heads no i wonder if maybe we could agree that one of the key differences between say senior developers or developers that stick with their software development journey for many years versus a junior developer or someone who might abandon their journey is in that decision maybe accidental or maybe deliberate where the people who decide

184. 3:55:00

     to follow their intuition their energy their excitement by reading the most interesting chapter first in every book that they touch by building the most interesting application in every project that they pick up by solving the problems that hook them into this work maybe those are the ones that become senior developers is that too much of a jump do you think kind of caution in the sense that it's also important to finish what you started it's it's very easy just like start something and then move halfway

185. 3:55:31

     get forward and then continue i feel like in order to really understand what it means to help software you can actually finish where we started make a polished product or never understand the fact that like like 10 of what you're building is like the exciting fun interesting part and then 90 is a total grind so you gotta understand that and understand what that means yeah yeah so following up on your first point of find something that's interesting for you

186. 3:55:54

     is this danger of this kind of um uh i'll get fancy here this kind of dopaminergic uh treadmill that you get on where it's going from one exciting thing to the other without actually uh you know dealing with the hard work so there's a balance i would argue and you're welcome to add to the conversation thank you for raising your hand i would argue that uh that balance uh is maybe up to the individual to decide

187. 3:56:23

     if you are feeling let's say high energy and excited about the topic i recommend to our students to lean into the hard work with all of that energy that you have and if you're feeling a little bit unmotivated a little bit low energy then follow that most interesting chapter approach to build up your energy so you can spend it on the hard work but the balance is critical thanks for

188. 3:56:47

     bringing that up did you want to add something hi i'm case i i did two studies computer science and also primary school teaching so i'm very curious what you're going to say about teaching and university um but on this point of how do you become a good developer i've also led development teams and some of the most brilliant programmers sometimes have the problem that they are always interested in something new and so i think an important advice is

189. 3:57:20

     also choose make a choice because you can get stuck in endlessly figuring out whether is go better or rust or python and for what tasks etc and a lot of the programming paradigms are good and have their own way of doing things and it's impossible to conquer them all if you want really want to be a proficient programmer where you can really make something um then you have to make some choices 100 so what i've heard you say in this other

190. 3:57:53

     tweet piece of advice is uh you you can't just seek the new you have to choose and in choosing you have to focus do you feel like that's a little bit similar to uh the follow-up that we had about doing the hard work yeah yeah and and so how do you handle this as a senior developer where you want to make sure that what you are doing and what you know is current is up to date to keep you professionally

191. 3:58:18

     competitive and attractive let's say but at the same time focusing on one thing and diving deep into it how do you balance that any suggestions there has to be a balance ultimately uh i don't know if anybody would give the advice to focus on say being a cobalt programmer today doesn't make any sense uh so i uh not a really deep programmer but i like the term of uh perfection is the killer of

192. 3:58:49

     good enough so to find that balance of yeah this is the deepest that i'll go through and i saw this in music industry where amateur producers never finish a song and i've seen this and where programmers never finish that passion project but it's find that balance of this is good enough and push it out yeah i mean it's i think it's i have to say it's quite difficult to know what

193. 3:59:15

     done means actually uh and i i wonder how uh how we can decide uh what that looks like i mean um one of the biggest differences that i've noticed between junior developers and senior developers actually is that the senior developers know what to ignore so a junior developer they might spend hours working on something that seems relevant it seems important a classic example is regular expressions

194. 3:59:46

     which is a kind of non-trivial way of you know manipulating text let's say so that you can pull features of text out but it's one of those things that's like a little bit difficult to understand and occurs very rarely so when you need it you need it but it's very rare that you need it so junior developers can get kind of hooked by this thing and spend a long time trying to figure out how this works but the payoff is quite low for them

195. 4:00:21

     i think just to kind of add a little bit of context to this conversation one of the challenges that we have with web 3 is this jargon this sense of kind of breaking in what does this mean how do i make sense of this new space and so on exactly the same problem is experienced by junior developers trying to become senior developers and by non-technical folks who are interested in learning about software development

196. 4:00:53

     it all feels impossibly far away and so having some concrete strategies for how to navigate that journey is i think a very very important conversation for us to have any other tweet size pieces of advice that we have any other advice uh two here first and second i guess hey i went on yes and i just wanted to say that you cannot actually become senior once and stay senior uh it's an

197. 4:01:23

     endless process right it's an endless process of learning so you can be senior viswab too right you can be senior with python but then going to web 3 with all this knowledge you become junior again so you just should get used to endless learning and picking the right information uh and the right market because market is huge and it's developing much more faster than you can because there are much more people in the market and you

198. 4:01:48

     only one who who should learn it right so pick the right product and start learning it and develop together with the product okay so just to repeat uh what you said in maybe a tweet size i'm going to reinterpret what you've said which is to prepare yourself even as a senior developer making this transition from web 2 to web3 that you'll feel again like a junior developer how many people in the room enjoy that feeling

199. 4:02:20

     of being confused isn't that interesting what i found is our just to kind of play with this idea a little bit our relationship with confusion says a lot about how we learn this is something i've personally been thinking about for a while which is that if you can imagine the process of learning itself you know what you know and then you move into the space of unknown you perceive this feeling of confusion of disorientation disequilibrium

200. 4:03:03

     whatever you want to call it and then somehow suddenly in the next moment you know so confusion for many people is something that we push away from ourselves we we avoid it many people maybe most people avoid this feeling but for any junior developers in the room and those watching at home what if we consider confusion as actually the signal that we're heading in the right direction and of course now we have to talk about

201. 4:03:36

     productive or unproductive confusion i don't mean thrashing you know without any direction or structure i mean productive confusion in the sense where you feel like you are disoriented but you can perceive kind of a sense of progress right it's not sort of nonsensical that i found to be very very useful for junior developers who are trying to figure out what to spend their time working on actually focusing on the sense of confusion

202. 4:04:10

     embracing that confusion and pursuing the parts of what they're studying that are disorienting right so deliberate practice some people call it you pick the thing you're not good at and you sort of work that thing right you may have heard that term so thank you for that you wanted to add something i think yeah my name is frat um i think it's a good segue also um tweet size saying could be embracing failure so it's part of the confusion i believe that this this is not just software right this is for all learning

203. 4:04:42

     um for you to succeed like it's failing is part of succeeding so that's your tweet size yeah maybe failing is almost like a necessary ingredient in success exactly yeah i mean otherwise it's like a little bit of luck or something i'm not sure but also education should allow or the educating party should allow or embrace the failing party too so the failure should be in the education itself when you're developing

204. 4:05:13

     a education program you should deliberately say well you're going to fail here and it's okay that's in that way you will be easier or less anxious to learn something yeah so and in fact i agree a hundred percent with that statement if i can phrase it this way that the the best way to design education experiences for ambitious motivated learners is to actually uh guarantee their failure so so it's it's it's totally counter intuitive to most of our

205. 4:05:53

     experience where a good lesson feels productive you kind of begin the lesson and maybe learn a new fact and then you are tested on that fact and rewarded with sparkles and stars and things like that that kind of habituation into the success of learning i think causes problems for many junior developers trying to break into the the sort of deeper uh well of of senior development and uh if instead we talk about uh failure

206. 4:06:33

     by design um you you might notice some parallels with um sort of the role of the software developer so something that's very surprising for junior developers is to consider that most of us uh move through the world interacting with systems that succeed you get into your car you put in the key you turn it it turns on you drive away and if it fails you have to defer to some expert a mechanic let's say

207. 4:07:07

     right uh same thing for maybe your tv your microwave your refrigerator whatever it is so most of our experience is success based we expect the systems around us to work we engage those systems and if they fail we you know replace them or defer to an expert but as a developer this is the piece that's a little bit surprising for junior does most of your experience is failure you start in abject failure you have an idea and no software

208. 4:07:40

     and then incrementally you begin to move towards success so so that's quite surprising i think for junior devs as well any other advice we have just a couple of more minutes here in this section any other advice for junior devs hey um anna here can you see me oh yeah thank you yeah uh i have several actually so first i would say the more things that i enjoy in life is understanding like this moment before you don't know and the next moment when you got it

209. 4:08:14

     and especially with software development um it's never successful understanding process it's always like you go smoothly then suddenly you have a wall and doesn't matter how many years experience you have so you have a wall and then you might spend i don't know seconds hours days months before you see the door or you understand that you can just go through the wall if you go in in a way right way

210. 4:08:45

     and maybe again it's not only software development but it's one of the areas where you can't understand everything and you need sometimes to rely and say okay i don't understand this gray area it just works let it be and um probably the most important thing is just to take it and don't try to fight with this like you can't understand everything you need to pick the like the pieces that would help you with your journey

211. 4:09:18

     and uh you will be super lucky if there is an expert or if there is a community who can advise you i think that's like the most important things that when you have enough passion and enough energy uh to to be directed like your energy and passion can be directed by someone and doesn't mean that you need to take that guru advice and follow it blindly but you will see the patterns and with your practicing like with practicing the

212. 4:09:49

     development and looking at the outcomes of what's going on you can decide if that patterns work for you or not if it does okay you use it in your next journey if it doesn't all right you see next patterns you maybe develop something you do like you make a retro for yourself yeah and you make decisions on what to do next so just i would say uh sometimes it's you know learning for the

213. 4:10:18

     learning but the great would be if you really have passion and you want to build something so that at the end you can see say is it done or not because finally you like you know in your head if it's what's is it something that you wanted to build or not because if it's just a piece of code and you know part of the development team and you don't care of what you're doing you will never get this satisfaction of you know okay this version yeah it's not perfect but it's like it's a baby you know it's a baby steps it might be ugly

214. 4:10:51

     right now but at the end yeah it grows to something big so it's maybe too many pieces of advice but it's uh what i wanted to say thank you thank you no no three or four very rich pieces of advice you just mentioned and i think it it will bring us to a close in this brief moment together nicely i think part of what you were saying was expect this journey to be difficult right it's a little bit like the gym you know many people sign up for a gym but actually the business models of gyms is

215. 4:11:23

     set up such that most of us won't go we will pay the fee and never go because we want to be healthy but we don't want to do the work of becoming healthy and it's quite similar actually many junior developers they get a little bit stuck because they they want to know more about software development but they're expecting it to be easy so i think the first piece of advice that you were giving was expect the journey to be difficult actually and recognize that

216. 4:11:49

     maybe even embrace that difficulty that challenge that confusion the second piece which uh and i'm i'm not covering everything you said but the second piece that i'll pull out is this question of community and and this maybe is the note that i'll leave you on here i think many times as developers we can get a little bit um uh kind of wrapped up in the problems that we're trying to solve

217. 4:12:19

     and forget to take an extra moment to help people around us who were where we were a week ago a month ago a year ago and so with this group that's here with us in the room and with the group watching at home i'll invite you to take a little bit more time let's say this month or this quarter or maybe this year to slow down when you hear someone asking for help and try and see the world from their perspective try and remember what it was like

218. 4:12:58

     to not be sure about i don't know this particular tool or error message or whatever system they're working with and help them to see the world the way you do not just by giving them the answer but by maybe reminding them of some of these pieces of advice that we've heard today about embracing the difficulty and challenge embracing the confusion finding uh things about what you're learning that build up your energy and

219. 4:13:29

     then spending that energy on the the difficult challenges that you see thank you so much for spending a few minutes talking with me today and i think we'll transition now over to the entrepreneur's section thank you sarif hello everyone my name is shashi uh before i start just so off hand how many of you are already bored like like or feeling sleepy anyone it's okay yeah i know no one seriously come on thank you thank you

220. 4:14:09

     so let's see how i can make you more sleepy or more energetic that is up to you to decide now i have two options here again everything depends upon what you want and if you don't give me feedbacks then i might be serving you something that you won't like so you have to keep giving me feedbacks so i have two options either i tell you what i know and might be helpful for you or might not or you tell me what you know about entrepreneurship

221. 4:14:41

     and help me improve the program that we run so these are the two options uh what will you like looking at me you might say okay it's probably to give him suggestions rather than take it learn from him but still what do you like so so second option what like learning from you guys right no there's no middle either this or that somebody said second option so how many of you want second option please raise your hand learning from you guys

222. 4:15:21

     that's the second option one two full hand memory come on yeah yes one two three four five yeah late risers like back benchers over there okay five people out of 25 and how many of you want me to tell you what i can one two three four five so basically you guys are like uh like little relaxed don't want to get engaged much just hear it out and all of that right that's what essentially it

223. 4:15:54

     means uh but uh yeah uh okay uh let's but you realize that you made that decision without knowing what i'm going to make you learn right you realize that right oh i'm sashi that's all like my parents decided to and i work in near education uh just to how do we grow our programs and i'm also instructor of this program called neo-certified entrepreneur where we try to see how do we help people uh startups come up on year and then

224. 4:16:34

     have that journey so so be let me uh go further and help you decide what you will like so so one of the philosophy that i'm trying to follow is how do we move from the focus on total value locked to total value unlocked like like how do you do that transition and what i essentially mean by that like when there is an entrepreneur who has a value to offer how do we unlock that value are you following that what i'm trying to say

225. 4:17:07

     so normally in crypto we talk about okay what is the tvl what is the tvl what is the tvl right so how is the total what is the total value locked and what i'm saying is how about switching to total value unlocked like in each individual who is coming as an entrepreneur to us how do we unlock that power of that idea that has and what it can offer to the society so that's the principle i operate from and the problem that i see which i'm trying to solve is

226. 4:17:37

     in web 3 the biggest challenge what i feel is we might end up with bunch of projects and not businesses and there is a difference there's a huge difference how many of you feel that like there's a difference between a bunch of projects and businesses like like yeah one is like base not even base camp one is like just at the foothill of mount everest and another is mount everest

227. 4:18:02

     summit right that's how it is so we all agree with that so so that's the problem i'm trying to solve so what i was hoping is to take your inputs on how do we actually do that how do we and it's also like when you hear the lingo here we'd never call it like okay these are the startups building or these are the enterprises building we call it these are the projects building and and the

228. 4:18:25

     moment you start that it gives that connotation right so so so that's what i was looking to take feedback from all of you that how do we in web 3 start transitioning from being projects to businesses and what does that journey look like as entrepreneurs that you guys are so that was what i was thinking of learning from you guys and what i was trying to make you guys learn was uh the simple technique that i have used for almost everything and the history of this

229. 4:18:58

     technique was this technique was developed to actually date someone and and this technique was developed to date someone and and then it's basically mapping the trigger of your user or or a product or anything so so so that's basically it it's called trigger mapping it's a it's a very simple technique where you kind of understand what is your vision and what you want to achieve why will your user

230. 4:19:31

     confirm to your vision and why will they not and then based on that you design your product so so this is what i have to offer now how many of you wants to learn what i want to teach and how many of you want me to teach so fans again again if how many of you want to learn from me how many of you this technique of trigger mapping or how many of you want to help me solve this puzzle of how do we transition web3 projects into enterprises

231. 4:20:05

     second option web3 second how do we transition projects from enterprises okay great thank you very much so so that's the seed question how do we before that one question how many of you are tech entrepreneurs here which means you you are a software developer and also a entrepreneur please serve hands one two three four five oh so out of around 25 probably seven or something right probably okay so so

232. 4:20:40

     anyone who wants to share what are the challenges of entrepreneurship in web 3 that you see anyone yes can we have mics going around please thank you we can start from there yeah guessing this is there we go hi hi everyone my name is amir um just one word answer awareness around uh what it's what it can offer uh to folks um that's the use case that you know people can get behind and you know it can lead to adoption so i think awareness around

233. 4:21:23

     its use cases and its possibilities is like one of the major challenges into you know bringing people on to this next version of the web okay so so basically what you're saying is people don't know how to communicate their product to others right uh there's definitely that and i think there's also the the understanding of the potential user base of like you know uh why is this version of it on web3 with these new paradigms and these new mechanisms uh potentially better or what

234. 4:21:53

     it could unlock relatively to what's been possible before so there's a bit of like user education and also awareness around the possibilities okay yeah okay so so thank you very much for that one piece of advice when we are speaking and it's not uh related to your answer but speak from your own experience and speak for yourself like when i mean that like in your entrepreneurial journey what you challenges you are facing

235. 4:22:19

     because when when we answer these type of questions we also sometimes answer what we feel should be happening so so it's not like a intellectual answer it's an experiential answer that i'm looking for hope that is clear some of some people over here wanted to uh yeah hi thank you so much i'm really excited to be here thanks for this opportunity uh so one of the challenges that i i'm facing

236. 4:22:59

     right now is trying to create this um the use of play to earn for impact to earn that's what we're calling it right so um this same concept is move to earn and we're being faced with the obstacle of if we create these employment opportunities that equate to uh beach cleanups and dives against debris then what does that entail for us legally right we're creating this bunch of jobs that are going to be paid through digital currencies and honduras and then does that mean that you know

237. 4:23:37

     this is a challenge that we're we don't know what that means are we now creating jobs that have you know payroll and all these other rights that come with within those laws or is that something that we just say oh it's it's an airdrop for doing beach cleanups right there's a lot of legal concerns there and and i don't know where to go for this we we have no idea so this is i guess a great example of like what's the difference between a project and an

238. 4:24:02

     actual company right very very valid point regulations right like every entrepreneur feels that how do we navigate through that very very very nice answer thank you very much uh we had some yeah please go ahead uh hi my name is ivan i'm from near pay i'm a product manager but also i had business in my in my past and i'm always looking right now for different business models and different ideas and i and every time i

239. 4:24:35

     realize that there is an idea i think why should i do it in crypto why is it not in fair because it's almost the same the business model is the same and why should i do it because the vast majority uses you know uses fiat for example i wanted to create the the bots for slack so that users can uh give some near to the uh to the guy who has a better day yeah okay so then i thought well why should we do it on near why don't we

240. 4:25:03

     just make the make the payment gateway so everybody will do it using using the real money because they are more fat money users than near money users yeah so every time i had an idea i thought why should i do it using near and maybe someone else has this these questions could you share that with me and i wanted to tell you that only in those ideas that use the near benefits for example sharding quick and cheap transaction transactions

241. 4:25:37

     yeah i could imagine uh why should be what should be a separate business but in most business models in most businesses i don't know why an entrepreneur uh a product manager should create something only only on near only on crypt so yeah sure also if if you guys anyone who is sharing uh some challenges and if you kind of align with that if you if you like feel the same challenge you can do something like this

242. 4:26:08

     like like this to so that you also tune with that challenge so so we know okay how many people face that challenge in the room uh that will be interesting to see uh so till now we have like how do we communicate the projects uh and the use case of it to regulation to to actually why should even i build on like web3 is this make sense yes please hey i'm not an entrepreneur but i just wanted to add a few thoughts uh

243. 4:26:39

     sometimes web stream market feels like uh developers selling to developers and what i would like to add we literally pay a little attention to educating our customers our clients so we have uh big investments in uh educating developers right but learning curve is so high for clients that you literally need to educate them so they could use your product and you need to educate them what is web3 and mass adoption is is

244. 4:27:09

     really slow right now on the market okay who else yes please go ahead yeah i think one of the challenges that people face in sort of like the line of the question that was asked initially is that as an entrepreneur the step of becoming going from a project to a company entails or like feels like you have ownership over a certain product and building in web 3 that's something you usually kind of want to avoid as

245. 4:27:46

     much as possible which brings in another challenge which is extremely slow governance um or decentralized governance instruments that are being implemented which is something more of the legacy projects in crypto are facing a lot like maker and stuff like getting something pushed through there getting a new organization set up takes like a super long time and yeah it's it's it's it's a

246. 4:28:10

     derivative of like regulatory issues but i think that that is sort of like why i would say that i'm running a project and not necessarily a company because it's usually look at near right like it's not one company anymore it's like seven entities that are all building towards this greater thing and that greater thing the best way to describe that still might be a project or maybe we need a new word for it but i think

247. 4:28:33

     that uh yeah that would be my my view on it okay yes please just wanted to pick up on the point earlier on why build on near i think it's a very important question or why do it in web3 but technical reasons i don't think that's very sustainable in the end you know what it really is about is community so you want people to speak from experience i've worked a lot in open source communities and open source projects as well and the power of why it works by people stay

248. 4:29:18

     that's really about the community the people that are there and that they have a shared sense of purpose that they know what they're in for that's what make things tick not you know we have shorting we don't that's those are things that can be fixed but a community that's not something that you easily build and it requires a shared vision um and now for me personally um also looking at near and a little bit the whole web3 ecosystem is is the question of um

249. 4:29:49

     how can i really add value for society with this british tools because it can't only be about money i mean money is a very important part but if in the end all we're building is is sort of more money tools our society is already too financialized as it is so to find i think are the opportunities to um improve for instance social networks to improve um how energy flows in the the the system the actual physical energy you know using solar et cetera decentralize that

250. 4:30:31

     those kind of use cases maybe cleaning up the ocean um i think we're at a point where it's possible to see that it's that we can use webtree for good but it's also hard to find the actual applications so i'm i'm curious it's just a challenge i'm sharing i don't have an answer okay yes please one or two more responses and we'll move to another question so i just want to pick up on the point

251. 4:31:04

     about why built on web3 and one of the things that we learned at mit about why how innovation happens is that you either improve customer experience or you reduce costs and web free just allows in many occasions to reduce costs for example smart contracts they you know they automate them a lot of things and you know and so this is just just why yes hi marshall from paris i think that what is important is to be culturally relevant and to fill a white

252. 4:31:39

     space because technology and technique is a thing and we understand the challenge of decentralization and how it can benefit to everyone but if a product or if something is not in a cultural way relevant no one is going to adopt it so we cannot only innovate we need to think as a business and how it should like be adopted by people because they understand it on a deeper level and the technology is on the first layer it

253. 4:32:04

     doesn't have to be what attract people people shouldn't know about it they should just see oh this is perfect for me because it feels new and uh yeah that's the point to bring culture at at the most important value that it should into the into the web3 space so uh how many of you thank you very much for all your responses how many of you feel like one of the reasons of these projects not turning into

254. 4:32:34

     businesses is something to do also with the user experience of these products that are built how many of you feel that way like the user experiences of the projects or the products or whatever we see how many of you feel that way but isn't haven't we perfected the user experience in web 2. so what's happening that that entire learning has gone somewhere else and nobody is using that in web 3.

255. 4:33:03

     this this this question i have like it it perfects like like i i really get like uh worried about this what do you think the is the reason you understood the question right my question is pointed like like we had all this research around like like people have spent 10 years perfecting how to click someone on one specific thing and suddenly now you see bunch of really nice use cases but with very amazing ui which you don't even want to look at so so

256. 4:33:34

     so why has that happened yeah from there yeah it has mentioned here earlier it looks like at the moment the whole ecosystem is still developers speaking with developers and there is a lot of use cases and actual business cases to be implemented in order to go to the other mass adoption but it doesn't look like it's happening if you go throughout especially in d5 space which offers a lot of opportunities and

257. 4:34:06

     much more than tradify but with very very difficult ui and ux that only entails for tech savvy people that are able to try to make all those clicks and make things happen it just scares a lot of people especially the non-tech people so unless that will change and unless maybe also the transfer between fiat and crypto will be a little bit more easy for example to actual pay with crypto in stores and things like that until then it will be

258. 4:34:47

     a challenge okay so in web 2 i think that data is central like data is money data is power in web 3 everything is based around money money is central every transaction you are sending some some form of payment and that means that the reason why things are less ux friendly is and why you have these external wallets that require you to download something on a different page that add more clicks decrease ux is because it's necessary for security i really feel like sort of like

259. 4:35:29

     education is going to be the solution and cultural shift to from web 2 to web 3 so it's just going to take time over increasing sort of like the web 3 ux to more similar to x2 web 2ux simply because of the security connotations that would come with that if you could yeah i mean like if facebook got hacked and they can read your vms that's annoying if your meta mask get hacked and you lose all of your money it's detrimental right i think i think that's

260. 4:36:00

     something that people oversee quite often like we're working on the internet of money here it's it's different okay over there uh the gentleman over there and then okay okay i would just add to that that the just to what jasper said like the learning curve is very high very steep and you know to the point of the user experience if if you look at the user experience for example for for the iphone it's you know

261. 4:36:41

     it's seamless it's invisible technology is invisible until we get to the point where technology is invisible it's really hard to get to the mass adoption um yeah so so i think one other thing that web3 doesn't have right now is the killer app the gentleman up front mentioned we have to kind of make sure we have cultural relevancy so i remember the days when um you know my parents were not really on

262. 4:37:10

     the internet right and then we had things like facebook and youtube and things like that and even though they weren't that tech savvy they figured out how to use that stuff regardless of how difficult or not difficult it was and things like that but there was like this like pull to actually want to learn a browser how to log in have an account store your passwords things like that and they got

263. 4:37:33

     used to all these idioms and uis you know that were frankly new to them so the thing that web3 i think is missing which i personally haven't seen yet and i think has to be probably beyond the financial nature of everything is a killer app that kind of everybody can get behind and brings that cultural relevancy then despite all the difficulties and all the additional things to learn i think

264. 4:37:55

     people would be energized and have a desire to overcome kind of these new concepts they have to have to understand also one other aspect of it is that i think there needs to be more abstractions to kind of insulate the user from the underlying complexities because uh you know i'm just waiting for my mom to kind of understand it all and then that's kind of the flag for it all so there you go thank you yes anyone else yes please

265. 4:38:32

     after this i have one more question to take and couple of responses we will be yeah so yeah i just wanted to tag along on the user experience or i'm more of the thought of we need to kind of break apart and build the user experience from the ground up going along the lines of we need a killer app well facebook let's assume facebook is or social media is a killer app we need to educate people born after the ipads and

266. 4:39:05

     smartphones that privacy and and your own private information should be a web 3 opt-in type of way of sharing like that you opt-in and you get paid by the um people that want to advertise to you so now the third party gets advertising fees but you as a consumer get it so i think that is re-educating the consumer itself and then we can start looking at what the customer experience actually

267. 4:39:36

     really is okay last i think i've almost ran off the time or two what two to three minutes okay some rapid fire responses quickly uh so that without a doubt social media is the killer app in fact any of the web too because all of the big web 2 those are in the digital space and digital is much easier than physical right so if you think about a real killer app for web 3 it should be some

268. 4:40:06

     digital thing that web 2 already has so take your pick twitter youtube facebook any of them if if web 3 can build it um people will for sure uh use it because look at twitter right now the deep platforming but it's not so easy to to take on this challenge so i'm also curious what you think what the feasibility is yes so quick question we have spoken about the challenges that you face and we have also spoken about the problem that exists right now if i have to run an entrepreneurial

269. 4:40:40

     program what does it should have quickly words what should that entrepreneurial program should have so that it helps entrepreneurs to scale not only get stuck at the project level but to scale to a business what do you think that program should have capital okay without mike's quick shout outs what do you think but people say that in web 3 you have enough capital business model validation okay so what else we have what should that program

270. 4:41:21

     contain that this helps them to grow experienced people who can guide them like mentors okay okay so for the program uh you mean like we should have users like like okay so users there should be a bunch of users around who understand they can be owners okay okay as clients okay what else we should have in that entrepreneurship accelerator or training program any else anything else that you have a suggestion on

271. 4:42:04

     sorry prioritization of man demand okay demand sorry yeah okay regulatory structuring sorry network people how to recruit yes okay someone said something from here did i miss it last it patience it takes time uh yes last one

272. 4:43:05

     development advisory team who can advise them on tech development and all of that okay these were really amazing suggestions you has been a fantastic audience to be honest and actually i don't know if you observed this our conversation turned from a dialogue to a multi-log like all of us were responding to each other and all of that so thank you very much over to you sarif thank you so uh we've got about 15 minutes a

273. 4:43:36

     little bit less for q a we've been setting and framing the conversation for the last hour thank you for your patience and participation what's on your mind any questions you want to ask of us around near education present past future we'll start with it an easy one from the front row i don't know if it's easy but what does near university engineer education do what sort of programs do you guys have thanks for the layup marie i i can i can take that

274. 4:44:10

     so near university as you can see in the background here has the um the honor and the challenge of engaging hundreds of thousands of qualified students this year in learning about nir and so the way we see that is entrepreneurs and developers these are the two personas that we're focused on this year and that's why we've had the conversation that we've had here you see in the right-hand side of this slide a number of courses that we offer

275. 4:44:43

     today you can go to near university near dot universities actually the url and register for a near certified developer what does that mean it means that you come and learn how to build on near using assemblyscript rust javascript smart contracts and any front end of your choosing and to become a near certified developer what you're doing is actually submitting a demo of your original design and that we review and based on that review we

276. 4:45:15

     you know give you the signal that you are now you know able to build and if not we'll give you feedback on that demonstration so there's a very high bar there it's not just answering multiple choice questions or you know showing up and you know checking off a couple of things you actually have to understand enough to build a solution of your own design that's near certified developer senior developers with maybe five ten years experience or more can come in not

277. 4:45:40

     knowing how to spell near and actually build an application in a day or two some people can ship something in an afternoon junior developers might take a week or even longer so that's on the development side on the entrepreneur side we have a program near certified entrepreneur you can answer this one so one of the things that i have seen uh for entrepreneurship it's important to have a community

278. 4:46:04

     so so what we do in ear certified entrepreneur then there is no entry barrier anybody can come but the course is very tough so first week of orientation we start with 100 enterprises by end of first week we leave we are left with 60 because every day 10 hours you have to take assignments and all of this and it's a non-competitive course what i mean by that there is a level that

279. 4:46:29

     you design your own course because what i feel is entrepreneurs should have control over their learning so based on your need you decide what you want to learn in the course and then you find your own resources there are some resources out there uh all of that you go through again this course is focused not on making your tech succeed but your business succeed that's the difference

280. 4:46:52

     of near certified entrepreneur and how we ensure that one is the because it's a non-competitive course anybody who's qualifies over a certain level and there is a level of rubric that we follow in that case then you are eligible for applying for a grant or applying for investment and all of that because then it's a non-competitive course everybody starts collaborating and if you go to

281. 4:47:16

     our discord server and see people post daily reflections weekly blogs about how in a month they had an idea and now they are sipping a product and what we talk about is things like who is your most valuable customer who who who how do you what what is the three different seating factors in your mvp how does your competitive analysis look like and things like that right and how

282. 4:47:42

     how do you use prototyping techniques to prototype your product and take feedbacks from the thing how does your market look like and what's the your total market size and and what's your effective mark active market size and all of those things that we have heard in in business world right and and and every week each of these entrepreneurs rate each other on how good is their product uh how good is the team how good is their value prop

283. 4:48:08

     how good is their value business model and everything so imagine over a course of like four weeks or six weeks a huge amount of feedback flowing through each other and what also it gives to say someone who wants to invest in these enterprises a high level granular data because for an investor what you are anxious about is how good is this entrepreneur and how good is his team and the product and if you are getting peer level data week by week that's that's

284. 4:48:38

     goldmine for any investor to make a decision so what we are seeing is how does people lose that frustration of how do i sip to from from individual consumers how do you become contributor of a community of entrepreneurs and and how do you support each other to grow together so so that's how this entire program is structured and now in the second version we might have a course on dao specific and and probably we are looking for experts for token economics and and things like that so so that's

285. 4:49:10

     entrepreneur course um there's definitely a lot of new faces since 2019 in your community um how are you guys thinking about scaling this program keeping consistent quality across these different you know education programs um i think that you know a lot of l1's have university programs and like once they scale they run into issues actually keeping quality i hope that there's a ton of inflow to this in the near community and wondering how you guys are thinking about

286. 4:49:44

     horizontally scaling these programs thanks for the question i think um there are a couple of um maybe we can start with a couple of assumptions about what it means to run an educational program and scale it and so on i think again because so many of us have spent the vast majority of our life learning in a kind of structured industrial system we assume that each person should learn the same thing the kind of the model assumes everybody's a blank slate when they walk

287. 4:50:17

     in on day one you deposit some information throughout the time of learning and then you test that the deposits are there and suddenly you're blessed with graduation but we all know that that is not representative at all of our individual experiences that some of us have different backgrounds different interests we have life events that might change the way we relate to ourselves or the material or the instructor

288. 4:50:43

     throughout the learning journey and so learning in general is messy so if we can agree to that as a sort of starting point and we talk about how do we scale education necessarily what we need are more teachers so what we are saying at near university is a thousand teachers leads us to a million developers and a billion users and in that sense it doesn't mean that we will hire and train a thousand

289. 4:51:13

     teachers to work with us directly but that we will do our best our level best to inspire a thousand teachers similar to the conversation that we started out with in the first half of this discussion reminding everybody here to take a little bit of time to teach people around you we've used a similar approach finding teachers in let's say how we are running education in china we started out with developers coming into the near certified developer program and then the

290. 4:51:44

     most performant developers the ones that picked up the material quickly produced high quality demonstrations and expressed an interest in becoming teachers those were the people that we went after and said look what can we do to support you in building a teaching program and that's actually the nucleus that we started with in our campaign in china for example a similar campaign out of mexico and near hispano where a number

291. 4:52:08

     of maybe 50 or so developers per week came through the program and of those developers we picked say the top two or three percent performers over the course of several months engage them in our fellowship program where they learn how to build production applications and ship those applications on near and then from there we went and tapped them and said hey come and help us teach now and so we you know encourage them to become near-certified instructors and now they're teaching there in china

292. 4:52:39

     near is being taught in chinese in mandarin in latin america near is being taught in spanish for the rest of the world we have english russian turkish recently launched near in arabic and so maybe to kind of try and wrap this up if we can agree on a basic definition call it a learning objective if you want but again that's a little bit too stiff a near certified developer can build on near

293. 4:53:10

     then the question is how do we make that culturally relevant let's start with language let's start with regionally distributed educational initiatives and from there hopefully we'll find you know the promised land hopefully that gives you a sense sure and so a call to action to all of you in the room is if you know anyone in your region who will love to anchor the educational initiative in the region where we don't have and there are couple of regions where we don't have

294. 4:53:40

     especially in europe we are like looking for multiple partners so please connect us and and that will be the good thing yeah good point yeah yes just uh remark that i i'm trying to get used to it but certified entrepreneur sounds a bit like a contradiction into meanness to me because you know an entrepreneur is just there's someone you follow you know that's an entrepreneur uh it's

295. 4:54:12

     not something you can certify or learn or there is a you can learn management you can learn um how to lead a team you can learn finance you can learn how to analyze a business model like you can learn marketing skills and lots of skills that are useful entrepreneur but the title is if it's strange for sure one of the reason uh uh for me it made sense because there is so much hype around entrepreneurship that you put entrepreneurship on a pedestal

296. 4:54:42

     right and how do you actually make it like a way of life like a and how how do you actually like and how do you like say that's one philosophical angle to it like like entrepreneurs can be made also like it can be trained and this is coming from like the experience that i had like for the past seven to ten years having said that uh and and the other part is when we say near certified entrepreneur which

297. 4:55:14

     basically means uh technically is someone who is qualified to build a business on here probably that's technically what we mean but for sure uh like like what you're asking is a philosophical probably debate no no that's fine yes i think we have to go to the last question by the way thank you um just to follow up on like that question of entrepreneurship for developers and entrepreneurs if you want them to bring in a billion users i feel like transitioning from project

298. 4:55:55

     to business where that's making revenue and actually being sustainable that's going to require a lot of regulatory clarity and structuring help do you plan on also adding like general counsel from the near foundation side to give advice and guidance and i know that you can't do that ad hoc for every project but basic principles of how to to form a project in the correct way based on what the project is

299. 4:56:19

     right now to be honest like uh we are introducing a course on uh a module on dao but but uh to be honest we have not planned that uh we have finished almost finishing the first cohort we'll see how it is and and the plan is that people run similar models as sharif said of or their version locally suitable version in different regions and when we'll see because the regulations in that region will be different from different regions so so uh probably there it might make sense but for sure

300. 4:56:51

     regulation is one of the key challenges that on that entrepreneurs face so sooner or later we have to think about it for sure can say from experience from flux i think uh this was like an area that we struggled with for years right um raising money and how and where was um a big challenge and you know we uh struggled to find the perfect jurisdiction for what we wanted to build and i feel like this is something that if we had guidance as an example earlier

301. 4:57:23

     on it would have really shortened our time to market and allowed us to fundraise much easier as well and then also deploy funds faster as well that's it that's a good point maybe if i do can i add something so i think it's a very good point one idea we're uh thinking of is what we call flow as a service and i don't know if yes in the yes and he's probably here or maybe not anyway he's like uh helping

302. 4:57:46

     because some of the skill sets that are in the foundations are not scalable right now but how could we actually have that for the ecosystem so that's definitely one idea and the other thing is um we're also talking with the idea of like a webster incubator and so within that if you think of it links perfectly with education and then actually more handholding of projects through tokonomics and actually legal advice and things like that right but we hear that loud and clear it's really

303. 4:58:09

     hard the regulatory landscape changes all the time so it's also even for us continuously navigating it's not but yeah ideas are coming so watch that space thanks for that marie okay that concludes our time together thank you so much everybody for hanging out with us and we'll be here for the rest of the day if you have any questions for us please do consider diving into near university checking out the courses we have there we have several new courses coming out this quarter in fact including near for rust

304. 4:58:41

     developers and that's in several different languages spanish and portuguese and english hopefully in may you'll see that course released and new courses coming out all the time thanks so much appreciate it thanks so much uh shashi and sharif super inspiring story learned a lot again um we're gonna continue learning after the break at 14 45 then we're going to dive deeper into the technical side amongst others with

305. 4:59:13

     jasper from from flux and anton from aurora so 1445 we're back here and then the show goes on

306. 5:30:39

     for our latest session okay i'm just going to ask anton paiself enter the stage aurora behind the scenes there's nothing to add for me there so until take it away thank you very much hello everyone thank you for coming happy to still see a lot of faces here so to start who knows what aurora is nice who builds an error cool that's also great because we all all pushing for new native for everyone

307. 5:31:23

     as you know but for those who still are already in in the ethereum ecosystem that's why we're here so basically aurora is ethereum interface on top of near and that's also like i've been participating in one of the sessions yesterday about layers layer two about scaling theorem etc and it was all about like what challenges we want to solve and because we have near and because of the way it's built and like aurora is just a

308. 5:31:54

     smart contract with evm inside on top of near so we don't need to abstract too much stuff we don't need to care about extra migrations of data et cetera et cetera et cetera you're basically like whatever happens on aurora happens in here and yes i am doing the integrations uh and devrel and it's mostly integration still and it's also it's like devrel for evm solutions is an interesting news because

309. 5:32:20

     even when you do hackathons and stuff it ends up often being fork-a-thons et cetera et cetera so apart like from comparing to the session before about education um we want to push more for education but it's like it's very very different because you're already like basically adapting for the space that was there before what i wanted to talk to you today about was mostly um about almost a year of the main journey we had on aurora

310. 5:32:52

     and some of the caveats that we had because like caveats are thing that people are really interested in i think it's like it's never simple shiny and all right so let me click or work please super this slide i snatched from the presentation are ceo edited several times and it's basically the overview so again like quickly to go through that aurora is the evm solution on top of near aurora is

311. 5:33:38

     implemented as a smart contract with sputnik vm on site or implements rpcs rpgs are fully compatible with ethereum we support all the like standard toolkits that are available on ethereum and we have ether the base token which is another topic worth of separate presentation and if you're interested uh about in learning more about ether the base talking as a decision and how it was achieved et cetera et cetera i encourage you to check the video about that as well but what it means for users

312. 5:34:11

     and like the overall vision of aurora being like aiming for 100 ethereum compatibility is that basically if you have existing ethereum contracts you just basically switch the end points to deploy two you deploy and it works on aurora like of course it's not necessarily always as simple as that and that's the presentation is about as well so one of the coolest things that i think

313. 5:34:41

     we did which is uh us reduced the smoothness of the sale was basically we went like we launched mainnet in may last year it was like in a stealth mode so people like would ask would play around with it but like for a couple of months people weren't actually using aurora and then i think it was late august early september then like applications started really to want to deploy in europe

314. 5:35:11

     and that's when we started uh uncovering some of the issues that we need to fix and that's again like going like doing maintenance straight away was very important from this perspective i believe because uh you like your feedback loop your loop of like uh reacting like yeah like all the parts of the feedback look as learning about stuff as fixing that stuff et cetera et cetera et cetera are much much more faster than if you do it like secretly behind the doors and etc so like yeah

315. 5:35:44

     startup mode and the coolest part about being able to launch mainnet that soon was basically first reason was that there was evm solution in here before so like aurora spun off from here um and it was of course already like and works but also because of the way aurora is made is done you don't have to like think separately about security that much because you inheritantly have all the features of near and all the all the security features are

316. 5:36:16

     new and also like our our second like main goal is uh enabling all other cool features that make near near with a dvm interface we just like when you think about it like it's it's the challenge so many of us are like from different companies from different types of solutions are trying to solve but everything that has virtual machine in it in the name always has pain but like yeah in a good way

317. 5:36:46

     in this case anyways uh so uh with launch one of the most important things for us was to do the integrations so the projects could actually launch because like very few projects work in a nutshell without any external um yeah any external dependencies so we were working on getting indexers on boards getting oracles on board getting not providers on board explorers etc and at this at this stage right now like already we have two explorers working one which is research

318. 5:37:20

     can we have several oracles including flex that jasper will tell you all about after me and uh yeah and not not for for not providers it's actually yeah i can't tell you more about that but like apart from the third party note providers it's kind of uh you can already if you want if you use or if you want to use aurora and you want to use inferior nodes just contact me we are in a closed beta and i'm happy to make sure you are added there as well

319. 5:37:52

     no like integrations it's all good like understandably like everyone was doing it et cetera et cetera it takes time and it makes much more sense again when you're live in a minute in my opinion um now the next thing was actually the thing that's like we were proudly owning which is the error more and more people started reporting to us which was exceed the maximum amount of gas allowed to burn per contract blah blah blah what it means and where does it come from so that

320. 5:38:24

     this originates from the need of a transaction to fit in a block and the rare being near has a block time of one second where like on average right where like for instance on ethereum the block time is 14 seconds so like and what block time means is basically the time computational time you have so you need to make sure that everything that you're works there and this was uh this was and is an ongoing very

321. 5:38:54

     interesting journey which also like uh we work closely with new york or demon so there's like um there are multiple optimizations done there are some in the pipeline etc that uh make like optimize all that stuff and as of march this year we finally like got to the point where we're seeing much much much less of those and they are like the the issues we have like we have another upgrade on your core that will go live in may that will eliminate most of the

322. 5:39:31

     remaining cases but it was uh yeah it was an interesting journey and it was like also very interesting from the research standpoint because uh we were like originally we thought that you can map ethereum gas fees to near gas fies which is like if you know like it works completely different so it doesn't make sense to try to match it so we were doing like and because people were actively using

323. 5:39:57

     and trying to make stuff work we were we had a lot of stuff that we could profile so like a dedicated team was working on that again together with near core and that went well but what i wanted to highlight here as well which was like an absolutely incredible uh experience it was one of the teams that uh from one of the lending protocols that natively launched on aurora was so keen to understand how uh like how evm works in mir

324. 5:40:30

     so they worked with our profiling team to figure out like how can they optimize the contracts from their site to to yeah to to make it work before the optimizations go live and during that process they actually helped and identified an issue that was an easy fix and that brought a very significant gas gas limit improvement and yeah so again like from being a person who is handling all

325. 5:41:03

     the integrations it's very interesting because there are there are all kinds of projects and the beauty of what we're trying to achieve and what's basically there is that you really kind of don't need to care about uh it being near under the hood because like the whole interface is just like playing ethereum and i'm i'm sure that we have projects that deploy it on aurora without like thinking too much about it being here which is

326. 5:41:33

     that's the goal that's like that's the developer experience you're aiming for right so um yes another cool feature we did was that we had and again another cool feature being a feature that turned out to be quite a pain in the ass in a good way again uh whatever that means it was we had abs like we were subsidizing all of the gas costs for aurora users so the gas was free and this is a big part of simplicity as an overall goal and it's also like we

327. 5:42:12

     believe this is one of the key things to tackle for mass adoption but as always when stuff is free you're a very sweet spot for all kinds of attacks and those would be like did they ddos attacks spam attacks and what what not and like again spamming you can handle but like you just burn money right so we were working on various things that helped us identify those malicious parties and but in the end we had to go for paid

328. 5:42:54

     gas uh because one of the legit projects ended up being also heavily misused and that would also end up in like in congestion the network now another thing is as elia mentioned uh mir has now has sharjen and aurora right now has its own chart and again the purpose of a as proper evm scaling is to be able to horizontally scale for evm which is like if you know like the nature of

329. 5:43:33

     the evm is the synchronity which is why no one figured out the charging for it yet and for that we will i talk more not today um yeah so right now we have paid gas it's kind of like two cents per transaction and we are also working on some very significant products that we will be releasing soon uh that will also tackle tackle ux um and for stats like so far been on the main that was given all the things that

330. 5:44:08

     weren't as smooth as possible but with projects and temperature and the whole community wanting to build and work on aurora that much we are we are already above 100 projects live we are like we have almost every infrastructural um need is diversified by like you can choose what you want to use and it's getting more and more interesting okay that was close so um let me let me think what i wanted to mention about all that again

331. 5:44:54

     i think that like it might like i will tell you what's next but it also is probably a good time for questions after that as well and for what's next it's enabling new projects in the ecosystem this is an interesting approach because like you know it's uh we're doing infrastructure and an infrastructure project we kind of like just want to enable everyone who wants to build but at the same time you also want to provide some kind of

332. 5:45:21

     ecosystem yeah ecosystem space where they can strive when they can be helped when they can collaborate et cetera et cetera so we are working actively from this side of things on making sure that we can enable those projects better i also if anyone has any interesting ideas about education for evm being there all the time but like with a new twist please reach out also like if you build an error also please reach out so yes

333. 5:46:01

     we will have a bunch of announcements in may and later this year which i'm we are all very excited about and i think it's it's a really good moment to answer a few questions maybe yes or maybe you can pass around the mic anyone has any questions it turned out a bit shorter than i expected uh so i've also had a few friends who are building on aurora who have mentioned this this block gas limit issue and maybe it's a bit out of scope

334. 5:46:54

     but i would love it to kind of go more into depth as to why this gas issue arises does the underlying near block have a gas limit and it's just it just takes a lot of computation to trans transpile everything or is it something else so yes it all goes back to the limit of community like so the current maximum gas per transaction limit is 300 tera gas of near and it's also like you

335. 5:47:20

     can uh tackle it from two sides you can tackle it from the side of like making the limit higher kind of but at the same time you can also tackle it from the side of making stuff that translates to that to the to the near gas much more optimal so right now the one of the things that like not basically the key upgrade that will go live in may is will bring like because of uh some uh tricash i can talk to you about that in detail

336. 5:47:52

     but uh when it will go live we will get approximately 30 to 40 percent more higher limit which again in turn translates into uh basically to best of my knowledge to eliminating the issue without compromising like you know like the obvious solution would be to have a longer block time etc etc but it's like you you don't want to do that and it's also like the one second block time to

337. 5:48:24

     two seconds finality time uh are like the mechanics that enable you to build so much more things so for instance even think about the game game dev right like it's the next level mechanics and we want to have it like the the idea is like to have all the convenient ethereum interface but like utilizing new capabilities so imagine that like you can still build without like learning new technology you can still build and then like have the experience that it's finally usable

338. 5:48:56

     yeah it would be really fantastic to have the ability to work more complex computation on chain i guess like with rollups you have the ability to because you have this like zero knowledge thing that can compress and be pushed to call data on chance to be verified uh i guess that'd be kind of like an easy i mean it would be like a very like near native solution to have like a roll-up that pushes data onto near and get the compressor efficient that way yeah yeah yeah i think a up on top of near would

339. 5:49:20

     be also a cool thing to to have like if if one wants to and it's like also not that hard to do right please hello did you consider other changes to build on so when uh you were looking at near and why did nier when so the aurora team originally spun off from here like many companies that do do that like like i mentioned earlier today and for this reason obviously no but it's also like um

340. 5:50:05

     we are looking into how others do stuff because it's interesting and it's also cool to see that now you can see like aurora when it was released it was the only one implementing the evm compatibility as a smart contract another chain now like neon is probably launching soon and they they are kind of in essence the idea is similar and like it's also a smart contract on salon in that case so and you can see that the view is shared

341. 5:50:35

     from this perspective will you be diversifying to other chains well i don't know like it's all i think like in the whole new ecosystem we don't think about anything like from the evaluation perspective more like we think about enabling everyone to choose to scale to go multi-chain like i i'm pretty sure that the future is multi-chain but yeah i'm i'm pretty excited about our setup and i can like i'm uh

342. 5:51:07

     i'm very excited about the announcements that we're but uh and also it's a it's it's a shame i can't tell you more about it yet so that was a yes okay we do have some time so uh i remember where i was uh when aurora got hit by the spam attack um could you go over sort of like the situation there because it's a pretty pretty interesting story right like it was running successfully for a little while and then

343. 5:51:41

     all of a sudden like this one use case just completely flooded the um the network could you could you go over sort of like what happened there and like how you guys experienced that yeah yeah i can tell you so it's like there was originally in january there was a sunflower incident on polygon that i think it's like basically put down the network for some time and then those like other developers worked the game while it was open they fixed the issue but then

344. 5:52:12

     like the original issue that flooded right but then when you have free transactions and it's like it's basically a game where every click generates a transaction so people were started with friga start started automating it and like a lot of stuff was like just it's like it's a controlled spam attack and you can look at it as a semi-legit use case well it's it's still not but like um and what was really cool that aurora didn't went down

345. 5:52:45

     and we like uh debatefully uh enabling guest fees i don't know like it's um we would have done that invitably of course because like you know uh also like people making money and so but from the perspective of upcoming projects um it all fits in the in division and uh in the future things like that would still be kind of possible but you will just still have to pay for it and that like again originally if you would have paid gas it wouldn't be the case but it

346. 5:53:19

     was uh the incident was like for a couple of hours i think in in the peak and we really like really uh reacted well to that so it was it was yeah yeah you handled it pretty well i think that the solution would almost be to isolate these type of projects and make sure that they pay their own gas fees yeah and uh also like you if people want to do that like in a scale you can enable that and

347. 5:53:47

     that's like also part of of the roadmap if like but yeah in the current setup you're still one shirt and because of that you just don't want to spam it make sense thank you uh not really an aurora specific question but could you share more details about the possibility of a usn stablecoin on the air uh i saw something about that on twitter okay but uh i mean yeah i mean being full-time into integrations i don't have time to look into that

348. 5:54:40

     apart from twitter that makes sense oh it's like yeah i i don't know if this question fits you but you you can tell me that's right the aurora dao council is as i understand and used to govern aurora and i was looking at some of the proposals so far it's mostly seems to be about let's say managing the funds um but but what do you expect from aurora or how do you see its role in sort of governing the network if any that's a good question i think that like

349. 5:55:23

     as with all those like you by heaven though you want to make sure that community has voice and that you do not um consolidate too much things like on your own so it's like the key idea and of course like a lot of stuff was about moving fun and like what not with the dao and those also like as a dev shop that's not what we do so that's why we have ecosystem and um if you think about it like i mean i know that there are some proposals in work that are not

350. 5:55:54

     like that are integration specific development specific etc that will also go to now and uh whatever else we would want to like whatever else uh meaningful decision you would want to take would would still go through it and it's for us it's very important to have big doubt and to to be able to yeah govern in the way that we see governance should be done so should an average user of aurora care about the dao this is

351. 5:56:32

     like in general they should i think and i think it's like the whole approach with the was with the government and we like i had a bunch of discussions with people over these past days about overall like how you want to like how you have a voice how you how you can execute on that voice how you can for instance give your voice or give your vote to someone who you think on the matter is more um more competent etc

352. 5:57:07

     so the mechanics i think the fact it's when you think about it like from the world perspective and from the humanity evolution perspective it's been like always some kind of loop where there would some like some organizations would arise then there would be some form of governance then it often would be observated in a way and then people would look for a better solution to govern further then

353. 5:57:32

     someone else like build that better solution and it gets either baited again at some point etc so it's like an infinite humanity loop from my perspective and important thing here is to always look further and look about how you want to enable things in the future and we also have one product and works that will be about yeah yeah about just members of the community and them being able to reflect their voices

354. 5:58:05

     that will also stay tuned for i'm not sure if you've ever seen my face so i'm peter other co-founder of flux um i know that we're in a ton of chats together all the time for integrations how are you handling the influx of teams i mean there's a ton of teams building now there's a ton of adoption a ton of things are breaking we're constantly trying to fix things right the process is continuing how has it felt how are you guys optimizing that what are you sort of

355. 5:58:42

     doing behind the scenes to scale integrations yeah that's an excellent question because that's basically me shuffling all that and it's it's it's cool stuff we given that we're more or less on the organic growth right now we work with various projects and depending on like what's been built um i would say that last year it was much more challenging because there were like more things that would pop up and for instance the mexican issue that i've mentioned was

356. 5:59:15

     affecting a big chunk of projects and at the same time what's cool yours like projects were still being able to operate you can still optimize you can still like but it's like it's left theorem compatible when you need to modify the contract so it's like not an option for us as a long-term solution but like projects that wanted to launch as soon as possible were going through it um from like from now onwards

357. 5:59:45

     we want to move towards the approach where we uh provide a more smooth without our directive involvement we want to provide a more smooth experience for those who want to build who want to start building an error et cetera et cetera by enabling them not only by grants programs but like by the overall like packaging and it will yeah um we're working it right now because as you mentioned like the amount of projects grows more and more every day and um

358. 6:00:16

     to be honest like they don't have much of the integration issues anymore but it's more of a like uh of how you can make sure and enable them to succeed so it's like it's outside of infrastructure layer that we are building for so this is like one of the reasons we want to extract it so you don't mind if i ask another question okay um so the rainbow bridge takes about 10 minutes to get from ethereum to

359. 6:00:48

     near and aurora um it obviously takes longer to get back i think about minimum seven hours right now um how are you thinking about arbitrage and market makers coming into the aurora ecosystem for dexes like tri solaris have you seen any novel approaches with different bridges to bring over liquidity um that's a good question i don't look much more in the economical aspects to be honest but like from the bridging perspective apart from like rainbow bridge there is a bunch of solutions that you know like

360. 6:01:22

     reshuffle liquidity not truly bridge etc which are available and um it's basically like to bridge to ethereum is also not such an often need as well like from the perspective like you want to you move to aurora and you want to operate keep operating right so from from the novel perspective i can tell you that we have a bunch of defy projects that launched natively on aurora and that are like again the landing protocols have mentioned like we have two native landing protocols in

361. 6:01:54

     the ecosystem and both of them are very like into doing innovative stuff and even like the technical teams are strong the like the financial interests like and mechanics that they're looking into restaurant but and i think it's it's not that often actually on like in the space to to do that i'm sure if peter had the mic you'd say thank you um no uh i i had another question is there

362. 6:02:27

     i don't know if you guys are allowed to answer this but if is there any talks with exchanges to support aurora network for depositing and withdrawing because that would actually solve some of the bridging issues potentially as well yeah of course yeah i know what you mean well for us it's again being a dev shop in the first place we don't directly interact with that but i'm sure that ecosystem works in some form with it but

363. 6:02:50

     i just i just don't know make sense but yeah it's it does make sense of course other questions cool okay then we'll leave it here and then the floor is up to josper thanks so much anton end of applause hello so um i'm jasper i'm the cto and co-founder of flux protocol let me first get a little bit of a grasp

364. 6:03:51

     for the room who knows what an oracle is who has ever heard of an oracle nice who knows what an oracle does all right who's ever used a uh defy app lending protocol derivatives anything if that serves nice that's good that's the wrong all right so let me start off with a little bit of history on us and near in our relationship so i come from ethereum development i was actually working on plasma back in 2018 which turned into roll-ups

365. 6:04:40

     when peter and i my co-founder met we wanted to build something that required um faster transactions and cheaper fees which was something that a lot of people wanted but we were building something in the prediction market space which was notoriously hard to sell to users and notoriously expensive back then a transaction in augur would cost you like forty dollars i think in peak d5 summer transaction would cost you four thousand dollars on augur so

366. 6:05:10

     that was just like completely unscalable so we were looking at different solutions and coming from the layer two space i knew that the launch of the layer twos was actually going to be very very heavily delayed because that's always over promised and under delivered so we're looking at an alternative layer once um we were talking to the polka dots of the worlds the solana of the worlds the ethereum foundation for ethereum 2.0 and we needed to find a team that gave us

367. 6:05:40

     the conviction that they're actually going to ship something soon because most of these companies had huge treasuries like polkadot had like a 100 million dollar treasury which was huge at the time ethereum 2.0 didn't wasn't in a huge rush to get something live and i mean we're founders we need to ship something even if it breaks like we got to get to market so we met with uh ilya and alex

368. 6:06:03

     who shared some of our investors and first of all their backgrounds blew us away and then secondary reading their white paper was really cool and then the fact that they were pretty cash poor at the time helped us build conviction i mean they needed to ship too in order to unlock their funds in order to get to market in order to prove their worth um yeah so we started building on near in 2019 before there was a test net which

369. 6:06:27

     was fun um i always say that actually the ux back then like devex was already almost as good as like eth back then it's only getting better we were building a prediction market protocol we thought that long tail derivatives had a very very bright future and we were very excited about it and then we went to market with it and the only people that were interested in using prediction market mechanics at the time were people that wanted to build sports betting and betting applications

370. 6:06:59

     and that was not why we got into the space we came into the space for the predictive aspects we came in for display to the space for the yeah the long tail of things which we thought would be a lot more interesting so from like a technical and philosophical perspective that got old pretty quickly like i didn't want to spend the next 10 years of my life focusing on sports betting infrastructure so

371. 6:07:24

     when we went to market with our protocol we found out that there were sort of like two parties and the one party there were the parties that were interested in the market mechanics which were these betting applications but on the other side the people that we actually wanted to work with the defy applications um they're like those prediction market mechanics are not capital efficient enough for us they're not interesting but that oracle you guys are working on that actually might be cool to settle

372. 6:07:49

     our markets like okay so maybe there's something here so we went back to the drawing board and we did one final pivot and we decided to focus on the oracle aspect of things so there's already people that know quite a bit about oracle but for the people that don't know what an oracle is and oracle is i think the best way to describe it is a data bridge so you bridge data from the internet or the real world onto

373. 6:08:12

     blockchains in order to settle to do certain things so this is a quick overview you just have a data source like an api and you have an oracle network however that works and then the smart contract layer so that people on smart contracts are able to use this data to perform certain actions within their protocol some example use cases of oracles are lending so if you look at like the

374. 6:08:37

     aurora ecosystem or near you have like bastion origami boro and then ethereum is ave a compound you have some perpetual swaps other derivative products and recently something popped up that's called dnfts which like dynamic nfts um any nft bulls in the in the audience nah yeah me neither but essentially it's a nft that changes based on certain external factors like data so maybe you buy an nft of a house and the weather changes based on weather data or

375. 6:09:14

     something yeah why is it important to decentralize an oracle why can't you just have these lending protocols shoot their own data into their protocols well the fact of the matter is that if you want to create a non-custodial product owning the data removes all of your sort of like selling points if you control the data for a landing protocol and you decide to liquidate everybody you can do that if you are the one that's entering the data into that

376. 6:09:46

     protocol so it's important to remove single point of failure there it's important to decentralize that process and make it composable permissionless we have a pretty bold thesis and the bold thesis is that currently on ethereum true defy almost doesn't exist there is like the unit swaps there's the curves the algorithmic d5 applications which are in fact like super decentralized but then most of the current defy is actually built on

377. 6:10:17

     permissioned infrastructure let's have a little little quiz a little quiz for you guys can you can you spot the difference between a smart contract build on centralized data in this house that's about to collapse well they're the same picture joke's on you so but it's working right like i mean there's been like one fat finger on the coinbase api through chain link but other than that there haven't been

378. 6:10:48

     many oracle exploits using chain link by collusion or anything like that well they haven't yet but essentially these data providers and that are being used in current oracles which is a very very small view have the power to literally rock the entirety of d5 if they wanted to and obviously that's something you want to avoid then there's another problem which is that if i was a regulatory entity

379. 6:11:19

     and i wanted to uh regulate something that is completely decentralized then i would try to regulate it at the only point that's actually accessible to me which in this case would be the data providers so in theory there's this thesis for first party oracles and i mean we're guilty of this this as well where you partner with high quality data providers to provide data on chain directly it's something that for example api three or pyth is working on

380. 6:11:51

     and it's pretty easy for a regulator to just knock on the door of these data providers and say hey you guys are uh providing data to a protocol that is doing illegal security or selling illegal securities to um us citizens you have to stop immediately like it's just it's it's a point of failure um so what's what's the goal for oracle's the goal is to phase out a reputation-based stake and replace it with actual economic stake basically make it permissionless and um

381. 6:12:23

     um economic guarantees and i think another really important part is to allow protocols to aggregate their data sources freely and actually support that we often advise are the projects working with us to either aggregate multiple data providers provided by flux or you know like use chain link and flux at the same time use api 3 and flux at the same time like remove as much single point as failure as you can because

382. 6:12:56

     that's the only way you're going to get well that's the way to get the most secure data so what is it we're actually building we have two oracle products today one of a is a permissionless first party oracle implementation we basically allow anybody to push data on chain directly um we do oracle aggregation like we said so we're moving a single point of failure we work we have these aggregation contracts that allow you to

383. 6:13:23

     merge multiple uh price feeds together coming from different sources and then we also have a third-party oracle which is a more decentralized more economically secure oracle that has some trade-offs obviously so the first party oracle is that simple it's what i described we provide high quality data providers with some software which is a provider node and these data providers push the data on chain directly to for example near and

384. 6:13:55

     aurora and then people on the or like protocols on the near and aurora blockchains can then use that data to settle markets perform liquidations change the background of jnft i don't know there are some pretty pretty obvious pros and cons to this the pros are that it's very reliable it's transparent it's fast and the quality of the data is generally quite high because you can use private data sources

385. 6:14:21

     the cons is that it's not very decentralized and it kind of kicks the can forward you assume that these smart contracts engineers are going to be you put the responsibility to like remove single point of failure into the hands of the smart contract engineers i'm seeing this as a pattern with quite a few protocols that are going live nowadays and i'm not sure if it's the best way forward but i guess time will tell

386. 6:14:49

     then we have a third party oracle the third party oracle is a little bit more sophisticated we have a protocol that consumes data let's say bastion they perform a data request so they send a request to our oracle contract we have a network of decentralized validators that's completely permissionless that oracle contract emits an event the validator network picks it up the validator network then queries the sources and posts the data on chain with stake um and then it polices each other so

387. 6:15:23

     there's like another step here where after the data and stake is collected then there is a chance for other validators to step in and dispute the answer provided by the current validator set it's economically secure it's pretty decentralized it's permissionless and it's versatile because it allows you to do a lot with the data um the con is and this is a very very big one turns out it has a non-deterministic time to finality the time it takes to settle the data to make sure that it's final and that it's

388. 6:15:57

     secure can take up to potentially even hours depending on like how long the dispute resolution mechanism takes because it's based on a game theoretic principle that we took from from some of the the other people that are building what's called optimistic oracles so currently these two oracle products combine to up to 830 million plus total value secured on near and aurora most of that is in our first party oracle

389. 6:16:27

     and well actually all of it's in our first particle where we're working what we're seeing with these optimistic oracles that also other people are launching is that the use cases are less obvious so it requires some hand-holding which is what we're doing so we're working with the graph for example on some use cases we're building an nft bridge using our third-party oracle another cool thing that's been built is by uma protocol they built like the across bridge using optimistic oracles but it's all built internally like it's

390. 6:16:58

     pretty hard to get engineering teams to yeah basically find vision or find ideas around your um around the optimistic products so what's next i mean the two products i just described had some prettiest pretty obvious pros and cons what we're trying to do next is build sort of like the end all bl solution it's going to be really hard we're calling it the http for web3 the idea is to create a data layer that allows you to query any data source from any layer one

391. 6:17:38

     in a permissionless and secure way we basically want any yet so the goal is pretty simple just unless you're from any application or any website you're able to make an http request we want you to be able to do that from any layer one from any smart contract environment um yeah so that it's mentioned yeah there's some there's some goals right so first of all first is the permissionlessness

392. 6:18:05

     then there's the economic guarantees we need we're building a proof of stake network here uh network network here um fast response times it needs to be fast we've learned that from um from from our from our first versus third party oracle research that yeah a fixed time to finality is just super super important and we want to be enable people to have minimal overhead on launching on a new layer one what we're seeing today in the market which is slowing uh multi-chain

393. 6:18:38

     down a lot is that um let's say there's an ave and ave would want to launch on let's say aurora ave expects their ecosystem partners to be live on these new layer ones so there's this sort of like picking order between multiple protocols they have to pick where to launch what when and that slows things down terribly so it would be way better if there's this separate layer that's accessible from any layer one

394. 6:19:11

     that doesn't require us to physically launch there so a quick overview of how this would work we have a flux consensus layer which is proof of stake there is flux tokens minted there there is sources that are available to query we have several networks that we support and there's an oracle contract in each one which anybody could technically anybody could deploy this it doesn't have to be us and these protocols query our oracle contract it once again

395. 6:19:53

     emits an event but it's picked up by the consensus layer now and the consensus layer pretend provides the data on chain after querying the data sources and coming to a consensus what the answer is there's like staking done here there's slashing down here and then the answer is posted back to the oracle contract again after which the end user protocols can then query the data yeah oh and token economic wise um these protocols have to burn flux

396. 6:20:25

     in order to submit a query and then the validators are paid through a minting mechanism so it's more similar to an erp-1559 type yeah fee structure that's it i have no idea how long it was do we have time for questions okay nice you did a quick one so uh off we go uh hi thanks uh i have a question do you have any concrete requirements to make an oracle on flux for example if i want to make an oracle that tells me the temperature in lisbon right

397. 6:21:22

     now and i can make a thermometer myself connected to the computer yep so everybody can know the temperature in this bun can this uh oracle be bound to flux yeah for sure yeah the like our first party oracle right now is like completely permissionless and in the future it will also be so yeah but there's we will be there will be only one thermometer only one computer how can the whole network rely on this yeah

398. 6:21:47

     you shouldn't but you can you can post it on flux nobody should use it okay great other questions uh information providers like walters klewer and there's a whole lot of those businesses how how can they work with you so how how it works today is we have a business development team we get in contact with them we give them a little bit of software they run it on multiple nodes uh or multiple servers and uh we subsidize uh

399. 6:22:32

     their gas fees and we subsidize some of their overhead with uh with flux tokens and gas gas tokens yeah so yeah but normally they have a business model they sell their information usually in a recurring fee structure uh x amount of uh display terminals yeah twenty thousand euro per thermal that sort of thing exactly you have something in your model yeah for sure so in the first party oracle model right

400. 6:22:57

     now we're subsidizing with tokens but in the future the protocols are paying fees to these data providers for the data that they are that they're getting yeah it's a the goal is right now is the bootstrap adoption so we're we're taking on some of the costs personally before before yeah putting that responsibility in the hands of the consumers uh so i was kind of curious about your point regarding the dispute resolution and the fact that you can't have a deterministic time to finality uh maybe it seems kind

401. 6:23:39

     of naive of me but uh if there are constitutions out there do have very strong finality energies like like tendermint i was wondering why you couldn't have an oracle network that uses that algorithm okay so the main the main problem yeah it's the algorithm we use but it's also the um the fact that the dispute resolution mechanism and our infrastructure today is smart contract infrastructure uh which makes it a lot harder so that's

402. 6:24:04

     why we that's actually the entire reason why we want to make our own um sort of like network layer as well is to be able to use those types of consensus algorithms over a game theoretic one purely game theoretics ones oh got it so you're off chain uh third like i forgot what the technology was but the oracle network right now is not it's just like taking an average or something it's not an actual consensus uh layer or i can't hear your question

403. 6:24:27

     right now sorry so your current uh like the your current non-intermediate oracle uh it's not a it's not like it's on blockchain it's essentially just yeah yeah yeah smart contract infrastructure yeah oh it's totally smart contract yep yep it's just kind of like you just submit a bunch of like estimates and it like picks out the outliers and then exactly exactly and then yeah it's like a folding mechanism with rounds and disputes i see okay cool

404. 6:24:57

     other questions i think we're there are you elsewhere right okay cool thank you so much super yeah then we uh head on um with uh uh three other presentations short presentations uh to to keep the attention focused uh please the first one is on their pay and then to others uh we'll follow that one straight away go ahead um and before already uh it's all already set up before we start this one off um at five o'clock there will be drinks

405. 6:25:47

     and there will be typically uh amsterdam brewing beers available there so um crypto beers i have to say even so be prepared for that but first off the story will near pay hi everyone my name is ivan i am from kikimora labs and kikimora labs creates different crypto products on near and not unknown year so today we'll be talking about near pay and my colleagues from the from kikimora labs we'll be talking about

406. 6:26:18

     rockets so and what is similar between us is that we are thinking about payments and we try to rethink the usual ways of payment of paying so let's start with the near pay i came from lisbon yesterday and you know i'm a crypto user half of my savings are almost half of my savings are in crypto and in lisbon i rent an apartment and i can't pay in crypto for for my apartment i also want to pay for water and electricity for my apartment and i can't pay in crypto i also rent a co-working and i rent

407. 6:26:59

     rented three co-workings for the last month and actually i surprisingly i can't pay in crypto for my co-workings so uh and according to the recent researches uh only 10 percent of crypto users paid for their food in crypto and we're not the only ones here for camps playing crypto everywhere uh by the end of 200 2022 uh almost 1 billion people will have the same problem they won't have a chance to

408. 6:27:32

     pay with crypto crypto in their daily life so this is a problem that we're thinking about the second thing is that fiat money is uh it has some problems it's it's expensive to pay with that money or receive fat money i'm not talking even about cash because because cash is difficult to manage it's difficult to receive to count for example i pay for my co-working using the bank transfer and the bank transfer goes for one day

409. 6:28:09

     and when i pay i have to ask my my landlord the lord of the co-working i have to ask ines did you receive uh my payment and she needs to check it and after one business day she says yes ivan i received your payment and i have to say okay and this happened with two co-workings in lisbon with me and you know it's kind kind of strange because i have to do to spend my time and she needs to spend her time

410. 6:28:42

     even if i pay with visa that merchant will get his money the next day or or maybe in some some two or three days so uh i think near blockchain has all the advantages of the cheap and fast transactions so we can change this and make it you know the different way the second the third third problem that we see is that crypto i know uh crypto is uh is easy for us for developers for product

411. 6:29:19

     managers for entrepreneurs because we we're living in it but for my mother for my sister for my grandmother okay my grandmother is too old for it but uh they don't understand it uh they don't know what blockchain is they don't they don't know what dex is uh so they uh can't buy crypto so easy like fat money they can't use it the same thing so how can we make the going on wrap on ramp easier

412. 6:29:54

     well near pay actually solves this problem well we're trying to solve this problem uh we're trying to connect this fiat and crypto world because fiat world is you know the amount of money in crypto world is in fiat world is 75 trillion in crypto it's 2 trillion and the amount of transactions is uncomparable and we need to somehow uh connect and intersect it and make the crypto and fiat work the same for people so they can spend their money like they do with fiat money

413. 6:30:28

     and the first thing that we're creating is the near pace solution including the near pay card we're creating the app and the desktop app that will create that will allow users to manage their crypto uh near for near the first place uh manage the crypto using non-custody custody and using a card let's see what are the features so of course we'll give users an opportunity to order the near pay card and so the user can pay it and pay with it

414. 6:31:06

     in all the shops in the cafes outside the u every user will have google pay at the first time and uh in the later this year we'll create apple pay will support apple pay and also every user will have will have an i ban so the user can pay with a bank transfer or he can receive to receive money so this is and it works it will be working online offline with plastic cars with physical cards and virtual virtual cards

415. 6:31:38

     this is what we are going to do in the future quarter this with this quarter secondly in our solution there will be the custody part so the user can buy sell trade receive send in crypto write an application and uh this is not the only yeah it will be near focus but uh the user can buy all the cryptocurrencies that will be in there and the main thing that the user will have the non-custody part there because we want the user to have control over his assets uh so

416. 6:32:20

     i'm not sure about uh different companies coming to the market what do they do will they protect my money if i lose them if if the hacker takes over the control of their server so uh we want users to be sure that they control their assets and they have to have a custom non-custody part in this application so they can transfer money from the non-custody to custody in the same same application and the last but not the least is earning we

417. 6:32:52

     want people to earn in the application we want them to have an opportunity to to do staking to do investing they can borrow something or or you know make have some insurance so if somebody here creates something for earning just come to us let's do some partnership uh when i've heard that many people are waiting for new near pay cards so when will we do this uh well actually it's right now it sounds it's on its way

418. 6:33:26

     and in june we plan to launch near pay cards first near pay cards for the new york community for our developers for our founders so this will be in june in july i hope will launch and uh everybody in our waiting list on our website um there are thousands of people that left the request they will receive the card and also we will offer this card to the new york community new york system and of course for the new users so that will be in july we will be

419. 6:34:02

     offering cards for european union first and then we will support other countries we are planning to go to uk and united states actually to other countries too it just depends on the legal part but as many users will be in the new ecosystem from other countries the more faster we get there so and we don't want uh to stop on that we want to go beyond that and we want to uh we want the users to have control

420. 6:34:39

     over their assets and we want to rethink the way that the user stores his money in the bank today elia told us about the active custody in his speech well i think this is some of the what we're going to implement in our solution or half custody active custody so the user has control over his assets that are in the bank so the bank becomes not only the payment gateway and the user controls all the flow of his money

421. 6:35:13

     so the second product that nearpay develops is the on ramp on what is the widget on ramp one widget it can be used for on-ramp for off-ramp for buying crypt so for fiat and for getting fiat from crypto uh we we want to focus focus on the user interface today we talked about the user experience uh so this is the thing that we want to make perfectly so that the new users that are not familiar with uh crypto they can easily easily do and this is this is what we're focusing

422. 6:35:54

     it but uh even if the user doesn't understand we want to make it sure that he does everything correct so we will have the customer support 24 7. uh we will allow the widget to work on uh the applications in the applications and in the desktop systems of our immersions and it will be easy to integrate into the merchant systems yes i forgot to say that the widget is already working it's on our website and we're talking with

423. 6:36:25

     many and with some of the some of the people here we're talking to integrate our widget to their systems and right now we have uh many projects in our pipeline so where are we now right now we're uh we're at the beginning but we already supports a lot of countries a lot of cryptocurrencies and we want to make it more we want to cover the whole the whole world uh whether it's possible and we want to add more uh fiat currencies

424. 6:36:57

     and we want to be near focus near will be the our number one it is it is actually number one cryptocurrency we will order the best fees for near for near and also we want to we want to add some different providers so the limits and the fees will be lower for our users yeah so that's all from near pay and we're not stopping on this we we have other different products for uh for payments for between the crypts of

425. 6:37:39

     fiat world i hope i'll tell you about them next time and now i invite david from rocket soul and camera labs thanks everyone does it might work yes we are a bit a bit ahead of time so i can imagine there's a few questions we can do too uh okay after this presentation okay we'll do it like that super hi everyone um so just bold statement uh what is the future of the payments and um why i'm asking that um we touched the time when the internet

426. 6:38:22

     was slow uh we also saw just the ranking of video tapes and we remember that time in the childhood when we were just picking up some tapes at the stores and trying to find something interesting then we went home and we tried to turn that on um i mean the film etc but now we just see that in the internet so something changed um i guess everything is running and all of us we're trying to do some projects um we're trying to develop something um but the one idea is that

427. 6:39:03

     one thing is missing nothing changed with the payments and what the problem we do something and we based that on the kind of bottleneck so um just imagine uh how usually your users manage their funds they have paydays they get money they do something with that they just handle their expenses at the start and then they're just waiting for their paydays again this is how that works from your side your users trying to pay i don't know

428. 6:39:40

     subscribes or etc and you have cash gaps this is just the one usual case which you have have to handle as an entrepreneur or or you just faced that this is the model which will leave probably some time but we um and our team in rocket are trying to handle that so uh what do we need uh for that something flexible uh something which would allow you to control your funds sounds like fantastic but as i told you about video tapes

429. 6:40:13

     that could easily change so we need something flexible we need something which you could control with just the button which you would able to stop to start to continue to add funds something which will make your funds um come alive so this is what we make at rocket yeah this is how the stream looks like it's not just a give file this is really the way uh how the funds are streaming interrogator

430. 6:40:45

     uh you can just deposit your phones funds uh just pick the amount to stream and just start that and stop every time continue and you can follow the stream with the link so this is the basic value which everybody here needs it's kind of transparency grants investments paydays uh there's just a few cases which uh probably needed this kind of um payment pattern just right from the start but i don't know why we're just still transferring the money and waiting uh as i once said some days for the

431. 6:41:26

     payments um and there are a lot of uh segments which um i said uh already needed that uh i guess that's renting just imagine you're renting a car and you have to pay deposits you have to wait you have to risk you have to do overpayments but you could just start the stream and stop the stream whenever you push your car just just one case uh imagine that you're sitting right there and you're getting your um salary just right per second doing your job that's fantastic that's not a future

432. 6:42:04

     that kind of thing we needed a long time ago uh government taxes uh any expenses mobile connection and uh just ordinary processing and as i wrote here just stream guaranteed loans uh that's just the basic problems which we face for example you need to uh borrow money but uh ordinary banks wouldn't allow to do that just easily at the moment they would ask you a lot of legal stuff

433. 6:42:35

     a lot of guarantees etc and if you would go to somebody on the street you wouldn't face something successful so but you could just say guys i have a stream which will guarantee um that i would give that back to you money so that's works um this is just a few uh segments with which needed a streaming uh and streaming is kind of natural way of transfers which we can introduce in our life and

434. 6:43:06

     how we do that and what is going on is rocket will tell my colleague olga thank you dave hi my name is olga so um yeah so where we are right now so we started in september we wore a metal build grand prize winner and since the september in october we were already in the main net and that from that time you can see on the slide so we already have 7 000 streams created there is more than one

435. 6:43:39

     million stream valued um stream value went for a qatar and we got to see the investment and that there are the funds that that support us so right now we are growing and scaling so basically raquette is already a working solution so maybe can you raise the hand who understood what we are doing so when i you know i'm a business developer i come to the people and i say like hi my name is olga i work in rockette and we do real-time finance streaming is like um and i i'm waiting for you know for some

436. 6:44:12

     reaction because usually people like what and it's it's basically true because it's kind of new new definition new term and it's not um really used and our team was looking in that uh in that area and we were really attracted with this uh idea of what what could happen if you stream money not like like one payment but you distribute all the time so for example we all got used to get salary once per month or if we are like it

437. 6:44:44

     twice per month but we working all the time right so we can get there actually the pay the salary every every second and that's actually what we are doing in requests and so we already have user cases that the company use requests to make their payrolls for us so basically you start the stream to your employees and the employee gets the this stream and gets their funds every second and then you can withdraw that money and spend every day and actually we are really

438. 6:45:16

     glad and happy to work in here because this is actually the place where this can authentically happen uh because of the low fees and speed of transactions so um so you know it's uh the the great place to to make um payrolls with via streams other user case is a vesting so uh it's basically also you can start a stream and you can drop coins to your employees or your investors through

439. 6:45:47

     through the time so it could be a stream for one year and your investor would get the tokens every moment and that's actually how we work with our investors as well the third one is airdrop so we recently finished the airdrop with paras nfc marketplace at near and they distributed their token distribution all the three months through raqueta and that helped to it helped users um actually it's helped by us you know to

440. 6:46:19

     distribute coins and not to drop uh price of the coin because usually when people get uh something you know for free they would sell the coin and it could influence the price but because this was the distribution uh all the three months um some people would get used to the project he would look at the project and at the end they wouldn't sell the coin that we that quickly and um so yeah this is actually the current user cases and um what is the future we are right now

441. 6:46:51

     looking forward for like new applications offer qatar and we see that there are different spheres where it could be used so one as i said like is a payroll like field and we can we can make whole corporate finance management system around the payrolls and make it comfortable for the companies to to cope with the payrolls on the on the monthly basis it's also we see potential to work with the grants programs uh so for the for the organization it could start the stream

442. 6:47:31

     to the project and then during the period of time he could see if they deliver the results that's fine if they do not they just stop the stream and until you know there is some some results it could be paused and then it could be started again um yeah it's uh it's a huge uh huge potential to work with the game projects and use nft streaming and use like rental um um renting tools inside the game so also we see that um in here there is a lot of

443. 6:48:14

     uh gaming projects with uh with whom we could collaborate for example how you can pay with the stream for the music and we're already like discussing some integrations with the projects who do whether music or you know um also you know actually we're also participating in a lot of hypotons we are really open to new ideas how our case could be used so if you have any ideas you can approach to me and we can discuss that um so apart from that

444. 6:48:46

     traditional user cases there are plenty of them ah yeah the most exciting i always forgot about this slide so because we like uh we are going to partner with near pay and could you imagine that you're getting the salary uh with the stream and then you can get this stream just on your card and then you go just to the to the bar and in the evening you got your salary and you just paid and that's it you you just you know you're happy and

445. 6:49:18

     this is the integration that we are going to to make and we are very excited about that and we see that there's a there is a future in that so yeah that's what we are doing uh in an european recreation basically as evan said we are working on infinite sphere and we are trying to think how how it could which different patterns we can bring to our daily like use and how we can change

446. 6:49:49

     our patterns working with finances and streaming is one of them you can scan the qr code so there's several links one of them like one links are connected to the near pay project another one to raqueto you can approach me i'm business developer at roketa we can discuss some partnerships and happy to answer your questions i can invite my team here as well and yeah thank you very much for your attention

447. 6:50:23

     i can imagine there are quite some questions very cool don't ask me what is a streaming solution i'm not going to censor people here hi i'm more interested in a kind of legal regulatory aspect of your solution so um you said in 56 countries and as soon as we start going into payments uh cards you quite often need um regulatory approval to be in the country etc etc and then you also need to do iml kyc on your clients so would you please

448. 6:50:57

     tell us a little bit about how is that process for you so crypto going into traditional payments you mean it by uh picard yeah play okay so um right now we're developing actually two products that will lead to the cards uh today i talked about the all-in-one solution which contains custody and custody and card the non-custody part doesn't require anything from you so you can just use your nearer like use you're using your

449. 6:51:29

     near wallet today you can come to the near pace solution and you can input your seed phrase and you'll have access to your nearest but in the same in the same app and the same web interface you will have the custody part to use it you have to pass the kyc of course you will have to pass the kyc and um to order a card you also will have to pass to the kyc for the when we launch in in european union you have to be a resident of the european union and then

450. 6:51:59

     when we go to other countries we'll have to prove the residents in those countries it will require a kyc and there will be some limits that we will have on the card yeah but it's all regulated we have all the licenses for the for europe for the uk we have a license for us so it's all legally regulated it's it is a visa card it's approved by visa so it will be like a usual card

451. 6:52:23

     there are some competitors on the market but there are no solutions on here like this and there are no solutions that offer all-in-one non-custody custody and card uh like i said did the disaster answer a question oh uh i mean you mean the video verification and the documents it it it depends on the country that you're in so it's counter-specific and we can just send you the list once it's ready for every county what documents

452. 6:53:05

     are needed to pass the kyc it will be in our help center i think in a month thank you so the first card will be in june i think by by the 1st of june we'll have the documentation ready hi thanks for the presentation what is the use case for the non-custodian card and what is the difference between that and the new wallet uh no no the non-custodial part is like the near wallet studio is just your seed phrase that allows you to do some

453. 6:53:36

     operations on the blockchain right so it will be almost the same the interface will will be different uh near wallet has staking inside it has defied the five applications inside and uh in our in our system maybe we'll have the same but the main goal is you to have a user user to have control over your assets and to transfer from non-custody to custody non-custody doesn't require any kyc but the uh on the other hand uh

454. 6:54:06

     the application doesn't have access to your uh to your money under on in the non-custody right but in the custody it has the the access so you can control which amount of money is stored in non-custody parts and in the custody part uh but the non-custody part is just like the near wallet i mean the the basic features are like the features of inner wallet of course yeah so for the streaming i was

455. 6:54:37

     wondering what is the overhead cost of that so um yeah thanks for the question right now it's just the gas fee for the stream start and the gain gas fee for the withdrawal so it's uh about 10 cents for the streaming yeah yeah yeah a wallet that cured by a ledger or something like that and i have like a spending wallet i could just continuously put some money in it like you know cash money let's say uh you mean uh would you get it right on your wallet yeah so

456. 6:55:23

     i would be able to spend it immediately right so that that's a use case i can think of that would be useful yeah and the question is uh does it works uh right now uh in that way or what is the question sorry no if the overhead's still the same so if the combination of roquettes and nearby it could potentially do this right if you understand correctly exactly yeah so so my overhead costs would be sort of maybe

457. 6:55:46

     a fee for the card or some monthly fee for the card um and on the streaming it's almost nothing if we understand you yeah regarding the streaming um it's every time when you withdraw your uh stream amounts so if you would um yeah if you earn uh for for example every second or minute and uh you would withdrawal um i don't know two times a day you will pay two times ten cents that that is the math and regarding the near pay

458. 6:56:17

     so uh in your paycard we'll have just the online conversion the only uh soon we will not have it in june but uh further this year we'll have it and when you just buy something in the shop uh you just you you buy the fiat uh we do the conversion online depending on the exchange course between exchange rate between the uh fiat money and the crypto and it's so so you only you have you'll have

459. 6:56:48

     to pay for this uh transition from uh fiat crypto to fiat but uh it's uh it's not overpriced so you you don't pay uh like 10 times it's it's it's like it's linear it's not like uh multiplied by the number of transactions it's it it depends only on the number of the only on the size of the total transaction card fee or i don't know yet well um we're thinking about the plans right now i'm not ready to tell you but there are

460. 6:57:26

     plans with a with a with a monthly fee it's not it's not big i'm i will be ready to answer you closer to june this june thanks so much good luck i think it's a very cool solution uh my question is if nearpay is going to be built on the back of your new algorithmic stablecoin that's coming out soon same way alice finance is built on the back of ust for luna is that also the case or

461. 6:57:58

     um you mean your pay card yeah your new bureaucrat no no we're not going to be based on uh on the stable coins any stable coins nor on twitter stablecoins and our other stablecoins we're going to be built on the